<?xml version='1.0' encoding='UTF-8'?><?xml-stylesheet href="http://www.blogger.com/styles/atom.css" type="text/css"?><feed xmlns='http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom' xmlns:openSearch='http://a9.com/-/spec/opensearchrss/1.0/' xmlns:georss='http://www.georss.org/georss' xmlns:gd='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005' xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0'><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3850995487033495036</id><updated>2012-01-05T20:40:08.478-08:00</updated><category term='New covenant'/><category term='sins'/><category term='prophet'/><category term='podcast'/><category term='child protection'/><category term='bible'/><category term='apostasy'/><category term='tract'/><category term='book study dropped'/><category term='mind control cult'/><category term='watch'/><category term='1914'/><category term='organisation'/><category term='stockholm syndrome'/><category term='medical policies'/><category term='jehovah&apos;s witnesses'/><category term='Kyrios'/><category term='Memorial'/><category term='heavenly hope'/><category term='christian'/><category term='jehovah'/><category term='jehovah&apos;s witness beliefs'/><category term='united nations'/><category term='prophecy'/><category term='wts'/><category term='shunning'/><category term='Ransom'/><category term='Translation'/><category term='disfellowshipped'/><category term='Lord'/><category term='C.T.Russell'/><category term='audio'/><category term='governing body'/><category term='watchtower'/><category term='Greek'/><category term='elders'/><category term='society'/><category term='two witnesses'/><category term='judicial'/><category term='worship'/><category term='watchtower society'/><category term='The &quot;Faithful Slave&quot; concept'/><category term='jesus.'/><category term='NWT'/><category term='New world'/><category term='tower'/><category term='death or obedience'/><category term='disfellowshipping'/><title type='text'>Death or Obedience</title><subtitle type='html'></subtitle><link rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#feed' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/feeds/posts/default'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default?max-results=100'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/'/><link rel='hub' href='http://pubsubhubbub.appspot.com/'/><author><name>Matthew</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08413266173326117804</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='32' height='32' src='http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_bXMuq_iFQxU/SdDRD7-p3xI/AAAAAAAAAB0/U0Meh0Y2nIs/S220/itunes.jpg'/></author><generator version='7.00' uri='http://www.blogger.com'>Blogger</generator><openSearch:totalResults>24</openSearch:totalResults><openSearch:startIndex>1</openSearch:startIndex><openSearch:itemsPerPage>100</openSearch:itemsPerPage><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3850995487033495036.post-6500462635019609958</id><published>2011-05-22T16:51:00.000-07:00</published><updated>2011-08-05T17:40:02.527-07:00</updated><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='governing body'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='two witnesses'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='stockholm syndrome'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='jehovah&apos;s witness beliefs'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='watchtower society'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='united nations'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='mind control cult'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='book study dropped'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='child protection'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='shunning'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='medical policies'/><title type='text'>What holds a Jehovah's Witness in the religion?</title><content type='html'>&lt;div dir="ltr" style="text-align: left;" trbidi="on"&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;During the process of leaving the Witnesses I read quite a few books by former members. Some of these books set a very aggressive tone which can serve to fuel the anger, even hatred of the Watchtower organisation.Some may find these latter books pander to the Watchtower's&amp;nbsp;portrayal of rabid "apostates" ( a pejorative term used by JWs in reference to ex-members) . And thus if glanced through&amp;nbsp;could be counter-productive.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;However some of the books I read were of a more enlightening nature. Books such as "&lt;a href="http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/books-book-reviews/crisis-of-conscience-by-raymond-franz/"&gt;Crisis of conscience&lt;/a&gt;" by Raymond Franz, a former member of their elite Governing Body.&amp;nbsp; This book helped me to see "behind the curtain" as it were. It helped me to dispel the idea that this entity (the GB) was being directed in some mystical, spirit guided fashion by God's hand as they claim.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;Another book I read, put together in a very simple format was "&lt;a href="http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&amp;amp;source=web&amp;amp;cd=1&amp;amp;sqi=2&amp;amp;ved=0CCQQFjAA&amp;amp;url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.captivesofaconcept.com%2F&amp;amp;ei=Xp3ZTejgO4G2hAf70Y29Bg&amp;amp;usg=AFQjCNFPa3UnMkkezXHiQydhU4QOzxa4Mg"&gt;Captives of a Concept&lt;/a&gt;" by Don Cameron. This book&amp;nbsp;was written with the sole purpose of exploding the concept that God has "chosen" the Witnesses, more specifically the Governing Body as his "channel of communication" on earth today.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;However most books of this kind provide information and facts about JWs&amp;nbsp;or&amp;nbsp;take the form of an expose. The Watchtower organisation is very well aware of not only the existence of these titles ,but the material therein. Which is why they vociferously warn against the reading of them to their rank and file members.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;Why is the subject matter never disclosed&amp;nbsp; in their journal "&lt;a href="http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&amp;amp;source=web&amp;amp;cd=2&amp;amp;sqi=2&amp;amp;ved=0CEEQFjAB&amp;amp;url=http%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FThe_Watchtower&amp;amp;ei=mp3ZTe2iIIPNhAfL9ZCwBg&amp;amp;usg=AFQjCNFzPNfJwjxjSwkoRsjWuxEYZ7epVw"&gt;The Watchtower&lt;/a&gt;" (monthly circular for all&amp;nbsp; members) &amp;nbsp;when warning Witnesses against "apostate" material ?&lt;br /&gt;It is because to inform the Witness&amp;nbsp;in detail&amp;nbsp;presents&amp;nbsp; a&amp;nbsp;threat and&amp;nbsp;undermines the Governing Body's overall&amp;nbsp;strategy. And that is to prescribe a feeling&amp;nbsp; of danger that the&amp;nbsp;"apostates" and their "books" represent. This same rhetoric has been applied to the Internet and "apostate" websites.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;Imagine a warning sign on the road which was blank. Would you be able to asses the relevant danger ahead better or worse if you knew exactly what was around the bend?&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;And the reason why the Governing Body&amp;nbsp; do not wish to even hint at what the "danger" is because quite simply they&amp;nbsp;would be&amp;nbsp;taking a risk that the &lt;a href="http://thegoverningbody.org/breaking-the-spell-examining-the-power-of-religious-rhetoric/"&gt;"spell&lt;/a&gt;" the individual is under will be broken.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;Granted this is not always the case since many Witnesses have read so-called "apostate" material and remain within the confines of the Organisation.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;For every individual Witness the "tipping point" which could trigger a paradigm shift in their thoughts varies hugely.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;For some it could be the way the Book study( a weekly bible&amp;nbsp;meeting in private homes)&amp;nbsp;was unceremoniously dropped.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;Others&amp;nbsp;were troubled by the huge error in judgement&amp;nbsp;by the&amp;nbsp;Watchtower Society&amp;nbsp;having anything to do with the &lt;a href="http://www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/united-nations-association.php"&gt;United Nations&lt;/a&gt;, an entity which has been condemned in the strongest possible terms within their publications for many&amp;nbsp;years.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;Many people have voiced their objections about the &lt;a href="http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&amp;amp;source=web&amp;amp;cd=5&amp;amp;sqi=2&amp;amp;ved=0CEcQFjAE&amp;amp;url=http%3A%2F%2Fthirdwitness.com%2Fchildabuse%2Fdefault.html&amp;amp;ei=357ZTaSDJ8KnhAepv6WzBg&amp;amp;usg=AFQjCNHr-iTJVhi_m1VF8CcXf1mwdl6LxQ"&gt;child protection&lt;/a&gt; and &lt;a href="http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&amp;amp;source=web&amp;amp;cd=1&amp;amp;sqi=2&amp;amp;ved=0CBgQFjAA&amp;amp;url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ajwrb.org%2F&amp;amp;ei=BJ_ZTaHbJcGFhQf709AF&amp;amp;usg=AFQjCNGQOVhw3Cfr1qmmu3ld3X5951bf2A"&gt;medical policies&lt;/a&gt; of the organisation.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;Some have serious doubts about the &amp;nbsp;&lt;a href="http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&amp;amp;source=web&amp;amp;cd=2&amp;amp;ved=0CEIQFjAB&amp;amp;url=http%3A%2F%2Fcontenderministries.org%2Fjehovahswitnesses%2Fcomparison.php&amp;amp;ei=Mp_ZTeDlHpKFhQe_1cjUBg&amp;amp;usg=AFQjCNG-eZE5P7HRa3e75q59lz-4z414cw"&gt;doctrines and beliefs&lt;/a&gt; of the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;There are of course many reasons why a person may choose to remain a Jehovah's Witness whether they've been exposed to ex-members or not. Some of these include a wish to maintain their "normal" life. Others don't want to lose friends and family. Many want to believe with all their heart that it's true and pride prevents them from facing the possibility of being wrong, perhaps believing that there's nowhere else to go.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;Could there be a mechanism at work whereby the mind of a Witness will accept&amp;nbsp;almost anything&amp;nbsp;and still be an "active" Witness?&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;Stockholm Syndrome&amp;nbsp;is a term&amp;nbsp;in psychology used&amp;nbsp;to describe a paradoxical psychological phenomenon where hostages&amp;nbsp; have positive feelings towards their captors. These feelings are generally considered irrational in light of the danger or risk endured by the victims, who essentially mistake&amp;nbsp;lack of abuse&amp;nbsp;from their captors as an act of kindness. &lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;It's estimated that approximately 27% of victims will have this response. To cite the seminal case;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;"The syndrome is named after the &lt;/span&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;Norrmalmstorg robbery&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt; of &lt;i&gt;Kreditbanken&lt;/i&gt; at &lt;/span&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;Norrmalmstorg&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt; in &lt;/span&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;Stockholm&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;, in which the bank robbers held bank employees hostage from August 23 to August 28, 1973. In this case, the victims became emotionally attached to their captors, and even defended them after they were freed from their six-day ordeal".&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;It's my contention that there could be a&amp;nbsp;common&amp;nbsp;thought pattern&amp;nbsp; similar in nature to Stockholm Syndrome&amp;nbsp;which could cause&amp;nbsp;some people &amp;nbsp;to stay or become attached emotionally to something which they may otherwise&amp;nbsp;rationally have left.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;I don't think it was a mistake that Don Cameron had the word "captive" in his book title.There are no literal bars and no physical location in which a Witness is held. So the prison is therefore a mental one constructed and maintained&amp;nbsp;by the person , but the architect is of course the Governing Body&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;via&amp;nbsp;literature published by the Watchtower Society.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;I will cite some examples of things that under normal circumstances no rational person would ever subscribe to. I recognise that the Witnesses use the Bible to substantiate their ideas and probably believe it has God's approval,&amp;nbsp;but putting the Bible aside are these things morally and ethically right?&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;Here are some things that routinely occur within the organisation:&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;ul style="text-align: left;"&gt;&lt;li&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;Allowing a child to die for ANY reason.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/li&gt;&lt;/ul&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;ul style="text-align: left;"&gt;&lt;li&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;&lt;a href="http://jehovahswitness.tumblr.com/post/57741556/shunning-a-look-at-the-2nd-letter-of-john"&gt;Shunning&lt;/a&gt; former friends and FAMILY MEMBERS on the sole grounds they're no longer part&amp;nbsp;of your group.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/li&gt;&lt;/ul&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;ul style="text-align: left;"&gt;&lt;li&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;If an allegation of child sex abuse is denied by the accused&amp;nbsp;then unless there are &lt;a href="http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&amp;amp;source=web&amp;amp;cd=4&amp;amp;sqi=2&amp;amp;ved=0CDgQFjAD&amp;amp;url=http%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FSilentlambs&amp;amp;ei=mqDZTeK_I8KyhAe79ejIBg&amp;amp;usg=AFQjCNEdVxuyi31PZP8CM5wIBA_PAH1AOA"&gt;TWO OR MORE &lt;/a&gt;witnesses to the event it will be dropped.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/li&gt;&lt;/ul&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;ul style="text-align: left;"&gt;&lt;li&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;Encouraging one's children to have minimal education, presenting college and &lt;a href="http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&amp;amp;source=web&amp;amp;cd=5&amp;amp;ved=0CDYQFjAE&amp;amp;url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.defaithed.com%2Fblog%2F2009%2F12%2Fjehovahs-witnesses-to-youths-stop-learning-stuff&amp;amp;ei=26DZTa3JI4uJhQfb0ay8Bg&amp;amp;usg=AFQjCNEc8BVd_CypDG-rOZxI5VQQBW8jUA"&gt;university as a danger.&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/li&gt;&lt;/ul&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;There are of course many ways in which it could be argued the members of this religion are harmed psychologically or otherwise. Some feel that the methods employed by the Watchtower have all the hallmarks of a &lt;a href="http://www.deceptionbytes.com/content/twenty-characteristics-cult"&gt;mind-control cult&lt;/a&gt;. &lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;The following are viewed as the conditions necessary for Stockholm syndrome to occur.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;dl&gt;&lt;dd&gt;&lt;dl&gt;&lt;dd&gt;&lt;ul&gt;&lt;li&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;Hostages who develop Stockholm syndrome often view the perpetrator as giving life by simply not taking it. In this sense, the captor becomes the person in control of the captive’s basic needs for survival and the victim’s life itself.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/li&gt;&lt;/ul&gt;&lt;/dd&gt;&lt;/dl&gt;&lt;/dd&gt;&lt;/dl&gt;&lt;dl&gt;&lt;dd&gt;&lt;dl&gt;&lt;dd&gt;&lt;ul&gt;&lt;li&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;The hostage endures isolation from other people and has only the captor’s perspective available. Perpetrators routinely keep information about the outside world’s response to their actions from captives to keep them totally dependent.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/li&gt;&lt;/ul&gt;&lt;/dd&gt;&lt;/dl&gt;&lt;/dd&gt;&lt;/dl&gt;&lt;dl&gt;&lt;dd&gt;&lt;dl&gt;&lt;dd&gt;&lt;ul&gt;&lt;li&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;The hostage taker threatens to kill the victim and gives the perception of having the capability to do so. The captive judges it safer to align with the perpetrator, endure the hardship of captivity, and comply with the captor than to resist and face death.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/li&gt;&lt;/ul&gt;&lt;/dd&gt;&lt;/dl&gt;&lt;/dd&gt;&lt;/dl&gt;&lt;dl&gt;&lt;dd&gt;&lt;dl&gt;&lt;dd&gt;&lt;ul&gt;&lt;li&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;The captive sees the perpetrator as showing some degree of kindness. Kindness serves as the cornerstone of Stockholm syndrome; the condition will not develop unless the captor exhibits it in some form toward the hostage. However, captives often misinterpret a lack of abuse as kindness and may develop feelings of appreciation for this perceived benevolence. If the captor is purely evil and abusive, the hostage will respond with hatred. But, if perpetrators show some kindness, victims will submerge the anger they feel in response to the terror and concentrate on the captors’ “good side” to protect themselves.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/li&gt;&lt;/ul&gt;&lt;/dd&gt;&lt;/dl&gt;&lt;/dd&gt;&lt;/dl&gt;&lt;dl&gt;&lt;dd&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;In cases where Stockholm syndrome has occurred, the captive is in a situation where the captor has stripped nearly all forms of independence and gained control of the victim’s life, as well as basic needs for survival. Some experts say that the hostage regresses to, perhaps, a state of infancy; the captive must cry for food, remain silent, and exist in an extreme state of dependence. In contrast, the perpetrator serves as a 'mother' ﬁgure protecting the 'child' from a threatening outside world&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/dd&gt;&lt;/dl&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;This mirrors the way a person who is a Jehovah's Witness is controlled without them realising it.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;Below is by no means an exhaustive list of concepts familiar to all Witnesses.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;And the "captor"&amp;nbsp; in this case the Watchtower Society, controlling the person&amp;nbsp;via it's publications.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;ul style="text-align: left;"&gt;&lt;li&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;Remain within Jehovah's (God's) &amp;nbsp;organisation for survival.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/li&gt;&lt;/ul&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;ul style="text-align: left;"&gt;&lt;li&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;Spiritual "food" delivered exclusively&amp;nbsp;via meetings and publications of Jehovah's Witnesses.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/li&gt;&lt;/ul&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;ul style="text-align: left;"&gt;&lt;li&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;Told to "cut off" association with those who are not Witnesses.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/li&gt;&lt;/ul&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;ul style="text-align: left;"&gt;&lt;li&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;Lack of perspective and objectivity , almost hostile to the "outside world" and free thought.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/li&gt;&lt;/ul&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;ul style="text-align: left;"&gt;&lt;li&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;Restrict or retard information flow from outside sources to maintain dependence.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/li&gt;&lt;/ul&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;ul style="text-align: left;"&gt;&lt;li&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;Captor threatens to "kill" the captive via Disfellowshipping (expulsion from the ranks)&amp;nbsp;and subsequent literal death at Armageddon(end of the world)&amp;nbsp;unless they comply by remaining within or obeying the "mother" organisation.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/li&gt;&lt;/ul&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;ul style="text-align: left;"&gt;&lt;li&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;Acts such as allowing a child to die or shunning&amp;nbsp;are&amp;nbsp;viewed as&amp;nbsp; acts of obedience&amp;nbsp;, loyalty and love,when in actual fact&amp;nbsp;both are morally and ethically repugnant to any rational person on any grounds. &lt;/span&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;And thus the captor has convinced the person that these&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;are actually modes of&amp;nbsp;kindness and goodness.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/li&gt;&lt;/ul&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;ul style="text-align: left;"&gt;&lt;li&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia;"&gt;In&amp;nbsp;some cases those who have left either by "drifting" away or by&amp;nbsp;disfellowshipping will still defend the Watchtower Society, even claiming they believe the Witnesses&amp;nbsp;have the "truth".(not usually the case with well informed ex-members).&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/li&gt;&lt;/ul&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;The effect is that a Witness &amp;nbsp;may believe they have control of their life when in fact they do not. All of the above mental shackles have been placed on at some point. They are told what to believe and it is of course subject to change. This creates a disorienting effect and keeps the person in a state of dependant mental flux. Perhaps even anticipating some "new truths" at their next Assembly or book release.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;The statistics show that in the case of Stockholm Syndrome roughly&amp;nbsp;1/3rd of people develop this mental state.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;I wonder if it is co-incidental that 2/3rds of&amp;nbsp; the young people leave the Watchtower Society as they grow up? I do not have hard stats but that's what anecdotal evidence I've heard. &lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;Could&amp;nbsp;it be&amp;nbsp;this group&amp;nbsp;who have had less exposure to the organisations methods and crucially more exposure to the "outside world"&amp;nbsp; via education, the Internet, "worldly friends" etc are not falling prey to the subtle mental prison their parents live in?&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;It is far more difficult the longer&amp;nbsp; one has been a Witness to break free, but not impossible. &lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;I hope that whatever a person's age or standing within the Watchtower Organisation they manage to&amp;nbsp;break the mental bonds and start to think&amp;nbsp; outside "the box".&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Georgia, &amp;quot;Times New Roman&amp;quot;, serif;"&gt;&lt;a name='more'&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/3850995487033495036-6500462635019609958?l=deathorobedience.blogspot.com' alt='' /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/feeds/6500462635019609958/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2011/05/what-holds-jehovahs-witness-in-religion.html#comment-form' title='10 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/6500462635019609958'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/6500462635019609958'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2011/05/what-holds-jehovahs-witness-in-religion.html' title='What holds a Jehovah&apos;s Witness in the religion?'/><author><name>Matthew</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08413266173326117804</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='32' height='32' src='http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_bXMuq_iFQxU/SdDRD7-p3xI/AAAAAAAAAB0/U0Meh0Y2nIs/S220/itunes.jpg'/></author><thr:total>10</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3850995487033495036.post-2308142165253744236</id><published>2011-05-05T04:56:00.000-07:00</published><updated>2011-08-05T17:54:23.998-07:00</updated><title type='text'>Did Jehovah's Witnesses become the true religion in 1919?</title><content type='html'>&lt;div dir="ltr" style="text-align: left;" trbidi="on"&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;Jehovah's Witnesses have the "truth" right?&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;Now any&amp;nbsp;witness will tell you they believe they are the true religion on earth right now....&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;But is that based upon the organisation's&amp;nbsp;current beliefs and standing with God?&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;Or have they perhaps always been God's chosen ones since &lt;a href="http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&amp;amp;source=web&amp;amp;cd=1&amp;amp;ved=0CCMQFjAA&amp;amp;url=http%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FCharles_Taze_Russell&amp;amp;ei=tdnDTcjsIoTKhAe0u6X8Aw&amp;amp;usg=AFQjCNHJa-R7YKo4VYLEEtIJWQvQmG2kUw"&gt;C . T. Russell&lt;/a&gt; founded them?&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;Or as&amp;nbsp;former Watchtower society president &lt;a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frederick_William_Franz"&gt;Fred&amp;nbsp;Franz&lt;/a&gt; believed, attained such a lofty title at a specific time?&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;One of the above must be what they believe.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;In my opinion the answer to these questions  lies in a long term strategy by  Governing Body 2.0 to re-shape or abandon  doctrines and overhaul  the public/religious image of  Jehovah’s Witnesses.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;In the days of men like Fred Franz and his ilk they totally believed in their own press and thus felt they were in a position of having “special insight”. Fred Franz was merely following in the footsteps of&amp;nbsp;&lt;a href="http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&amp;amp;source=web&amp;amp;cd=1&amp;amp;ved=0CCMQFjAA&amp;amp;url=http%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FJoseph_Franklin_Rutherford&amp;amp;ei=PtnDTd3YKNGHhQfftsGIBA&amp;amp;usg=AFQjCNGtZNMw9o-YPDTQmLq_wPJuyJVokQ"&gt;"judge" Rutherford&lt;/a&gt; and his predecessor Charles Russell, the religion's founder, in his mind-set.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;Franz believed the Witnesses, although known as the Bible students at the time&amp;nbsp;were "chosen" by Jesus himself during an "invisible" visit to earth to inspect the world's religions around the year 1919 a.d.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;Now how&amp;nbsp;does that above statement sound ? Would a "householder"&amp;nbsp;of the &amp;nbsp;21st century be likely to buy into that&amp;nbsp;during a visit from a Jehovah's Witness at their door?&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;Remember ultimately they are a publishing corporation with a product to "sell" whether that be books, donations to the cause or joining the religion. Products have to be saleable and attractive to prospective buyers.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;So the previous "product" sold. The end is coming! The people flooded in and so did the money......1975 and all that......&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;Unfortunately&amp;nbsp; the product eventually&amp;nbsp;passed it's sell-by date in the shape of&amp;nbsp;the combined "insights" of Russell, Rutherford and Franz&amp;nbsp; when they turned out to be poorly judged guesswork and idle speculation at best.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;The newest members of the GB couldn’t fail to notice these events&amp;nbsp;whether they were in power at the time or not. Hence when those older men finally died off I believe that GB 2.0 would be acutely aware of their own lack of “special insight”. &lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;Perhaps an awareness  of the impact these failed doctrines had on the rank and file witnesses and in the case of  the 1975 “prochecy” , the general public&amp;nbsp; they decided to scale back on the doctrinal side.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;As evidence for my line of reasoning I will cite some examples.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;1.The abandonment of doctrines with an associated date i.e. 1935 and the “final sealing” of the “annointed” (may 2007 wt.)&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;2. Dates such as 1914 slowly being degraded in the jw mindset facilitated by being mentioned less and less in their literature over a 10-15 year period to the present day. One recent  2010 Watchtower’s cover asked “what is the kingdom?” This magazine when read cover to cover did not mention 1914 once.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana;"&gt;Surely the date&amp;nbsp; 1914 on&amp;nbsp; which the entire authority and doctrinal foundations of the the Jehovah's Witnesses rests deserves to be at the forefront of their message? My objective assessment of the &lt;a href="http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2011/04/1914-honest-evaluation.html"&gt;1914&lt;/a&gt; doctrine can be found &lt;a href="http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2011/04/1914-honest-evaluation.html"&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;3.The “appointment” of the “slave class” in 1919&amp;nbsp;dogma slowly being replaced by&amp;nbsp;already existing&amp;nbsp;concepts that JW’s are the “closest thing to 1st century Christianity” and have the “mark of love”  and are the only ones doing the “preaching work”. Ideas which are much easier&amp;nbsp;to defend and substantiate and thoughts which are already in the minds of many Witnesses. &amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; This&amp;nbsp; is discussed in more detail in &lt;a href="http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/05/new-light-on-wts-being-appointed.html"&gt;this blog&lt;/a&gt; I wrote two years ago.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;4. A concerted effort to APPEAR more mainstream and like other “Christian” groups. Dumbing down in doctrines and literature, legal department softening medical policies, less meetings, lower pioneer hours etc, etc.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;Of course the problem every member of the current Governing Body has is what to do with all the&amp;nbsp;dated&amp;nbsp;, failed&amp;nbsp;old doctrines which many built their whole lives on?&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;It seems that 1914, 1919, 1975, and the "generation" teaching are somewhat of an embarrassment to the Governing Body today.&lt;br /&gt;There is unfortunately no&amp;nbsp;panacea as I’m sure they realise.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;An example&amp;nbsp;is the recent overhaul of&amp;nbsp;an old&amp;nbsp;doctrine in the shape of the&amp;nbsp;paradoxical two-part overlapping generation. A&amp;nbsp; hybrid doctrine of the&amp;nbsp;&lt;a href="http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&amp;amp;source=web&amp;amp;cd=3&amp;amp;ved=0CCsQFjAC&amp;amp;url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cftf.com%2F1914%2Findex.html&amp;amp;ei=w47ITYy9HoXUsgaEx_SoAw&amp;amp;usg=AFQjCNFJSRDmqDupwns64EoLZ0svNQInbA"&gt;"creators promise"&lt;/a&gt; that those alive in 1914&amp;nbsp;would see the end, with the new generation of “anointed” alive today&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; overlapping  them&amp;nbsp;as the ones who&amp;nbsp;ultimately see the end of this system. Co-incidentally these&amp;nbsp;"new members" in the generation dogma&amp;nbsp;just happen to include the majority of the Governing Body who are much too young too fit in with the old teaching......&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;This teaching epitomises the dilemma the GB find themselves in:-&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana;"&gt;The generation of 1914 clearly almost all dead, so therefore the old&amp;nbsp;doctrine or "prophecy" is demonstrably false.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;No new “light” to completely replace it.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Can’t completely bin old doctrines, as older ones would react adversely.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;A need to give the rank and file something to bite on, a little hope, so therefore modify the doctrine to give the impression the "end" could still be quite close.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;So the only option is to fire fight with face-saving nonsense.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;So just to get this straight. Jesus was asked a question&amp;nbsp;in &lt;a href="http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&amp;amp;source=web&amp;amp;cd=2&amp;amp;ved=0CCMQFjAB&amp;amp;url=http%3A%2F%2Fexpositorythoughts.wordpress.com%2F2008%2F03%2F28%2Fthis-generation-in-matthew-2434%2F&amp;amp;ei=w47ITYy9HoXUsgaEx_SoAw&amp;amp;usg=AFQjCNHhaq6pHzojnoVf0bdYRObZJmbrnQ"&gt;Matt 24:34&lt;/a&gt;. He &amp;nbsp;answered that question&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;with the words "this generation will by no means pass away".&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;&amp;nbsp;What he actually meant was a group of people would see the year 1914 and the "signs" of his "invisible presence"&amp;nbsp;and their generation&amp;nbsp;would&amp;nbsp;overlap a&amp;nbsp;SECOND group&amp;nbsp; of people who would then in turn see the end of the world?&amp;nbsp;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana;"&gt;Really? Does it seem reasonable that's what Jesus Christ 2000 years ago was referring to?&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;The leaders  have probably come to the conclusion that most Jehovah’s Witnesses will believe whatever they are told and will follow this organisation till they die.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana, sans-serif;"&gt;So the Organisation's&amp;nbsp;remit is to make it easier to believe, easier to defend to their “opposers” and easier on the eye to governments and the public.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana;"&gt;Jehovah's Witnesses have taught for almost 100 years that they were chosen by Jesus in the year 1919 as the one true religion.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana;"&gt;If this is correct what should you do?&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: Verdana;"&gt;If this is proved to be false what should you do?&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/3850995487033495036-2308142165253744236?l=deathorobedience.blogspot.com' alt='' /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/feeds/2308142165253744236/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2011/05/when-did-jehovahs-witnesses-become.html#comment-form' title='3 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/2308142165253744236'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/2308142165253744236'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2011/05/when-did-jehovahs-witnesses-become.html' title='Did Jehovah&apos;s Witnesses become the true religion in 1919?'/><author><name>Matthew</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08413266173326117804</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='32' height='32' src='http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_bXMuq_iFQxU/SdDRD7-p3xI/AAAAAAAAAB0/U0Meh0Y2nIs/S220/itunes.jpg'/></author><thr:total>3</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3850995487033495036.post-3731494057155669667</id><published>2011-04-30T03:38:00.000-07:00</published><updated>2011-05-21T13:25:55.014-07:00</updated><title type='text'>1914 an honest evaluation.</title><content type='html'>&lt;div dir="ltr" style="text-align: left;" trbidi="on"&gt;&lt;strike&gt;&lt;strike&gt;&lt;/strike&gt;&lt;/strike&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: times new roman;"&gt;If there is one single year that is pivotal to the teachings of a religious group then it surely has to be the year 1914 A.D. and the group now known as Jehovah's Witnesses.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The  modern young Jehovah's Witnesses that I knew did not really pay much attention to the year 1914. Even some of the older ones have recently stated "that it's just a date when the Gentile times ended"  It has no real meaning to them although without them realising it,  it is the sole reason they are in fact Jehovah's Witnesses and not say ,the religion of their grandparents.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;To the uninitiated the basic import of the doctrine of 1914 is that Jesus began ruling in his invisible heavenly kingdom in October 4th or 5th of that year. This is worked out by using what the Watchtower Society calls "Bible Chronology".&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Here is a link to   the  &lt;/span&gt;&lt;a href="http://www.watchtower.org/e/bh/appendix_10.htm" style="font-family: trebuchet ms;"&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: times new roman;"&gt;Watchtower explanation&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: times new roman;"&gt; on their official website.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;If you have read the article you will notice that the Bible students apparently "decades in advance"  said that there would be "significant developments" in 1914.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The only problem is that of all the things C.T. Russell said about the year 1914 not one of them came to pass. Here is a link to the &lt;/span&gt;&lt;a href="http://www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/failed-1914-predictions.php"&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: times new roman;"&gt;failed predictions&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: times new roman;"&gt;. The one thing that DID happen of course was the great war which seemed to validate the idea (at least among the Bible students) , as JW's were called then, that they were on to something.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The next port of call in the doctrine is to link the "Appointed times of the nations"( Luke21)&lt;br /&gt;With the "Gentile times" of Daniel 4. However there is no Biblical Imperative to link these two accounts as it's clear Jesus was referring to a FUTURE  event , not looking back almost 600 years to the previous destruction of Jerusalem. Jesus was giving a prophecy remember. Prophecies are not retroactive in this sense.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;This brings us to the next part of this "chronology" ; the year 607 B.C.E. , the year which The Watchtower Society (WTS) say Jerusalem was destroyed by the Babylonians. All modern experts in all related fields say that it was in fact the year 587 B.C.E. that this event took place.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The Watchtower Society claim is that if it is the Bible versus "secular" sources then they will choose the Bible. There is a problem however as the Bible contains no fixed B.C.E. dates with which one could determine the exact timing of  events. Only the events themselves and people's births, deaths, ages and in the case of kings how long they ruled for etc is described.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The problem the watchtower Society have with this idea of the Bible "fixing"  the event of Jerusalem's destruction to the year 607 B.C.E. is that people such as &lt;/span&gt;&lt;a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eschatology_of_Jehovah%27s_Witnesses" style="font-family: trebuchet ms;"&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: times new roman;"&gt;Carl  O. Jonsson&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: times new roman;"&gt; have spent decades proving beyond any reasonable doubt that the Bible actually testifies that the date of 587 B.C.E. is the most likely date,  rather than the "Watchtower date" of 607 B.C.E.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;This period of history known as the "Neo Babylonian"  era is probably one of the best attested to times from an historical  ,archaeological and astronomical perspective which gives the Watchtower Society a massive headache. All of these fields combine to point towards the most likely date of 587 B.C.E. ( Incidentally these same experts are who the Society rely on to produce the "pivotal Date "  of 539 B.C.E.)&lt;br /&gt;I have challenged several JW's to give me just one quote from a modern scholar who is not connected to the Watchtower who will testify that the above event took place in 607 B.C.E.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I'm still waiting.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;However how do they calculate back to the date 607 B.C.E. from the date of 1914 C.E.?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The explanation is as follows:-&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;div style="font-family: trebuchet ms;"&gt;&lt;a href="javascript:showCitedScripture("&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: times new roman;"&gt;"Revelation 12:6&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: times new roman;"&gt;, &lt;/span&gt;&lt;a href="javascript:showCitedScripture("&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: times new roman;"&gt;14&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: times new roman;"&gt; indicates that three and a half times equal “a thousand two hundred and sixty days.” “Seven times” would therefore last twice as long, or 2,520 days. But the Gentile nations did not stop ‘trampling’ on God’s ruler-ship a mere 2,520 days after Jerusalem’s fall. Evidently, then, this prophecy covers a much longer period of time. On the basis of &lt;/span&gt;&lt;a href="javascript:showCitedScripture("&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: times new roman;"&gt;Numbers 14:34&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: times new roman;"&gt; and &lt;/span&gt;&lt;a href="javascript:showCitedScripture("&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: times new roman;"&gt;Ezekiel 4:6&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: times new roman;"&gt;,  which speak of “a day for a year,” the “seven times” would  cover 2,520 &lt;em&gt;years.&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: times new roman;"&gt;  The 2,520 years began in October 607 B.C.E., when Jerusalem fell to the Babylonians and the Davidic king was taken off his throne. The period ended in October 1914. At that time, “the appointed times of the nations” ended, and Jesus Christ was installed as God’s heavenly King."&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Did you notice the way that various disparate parts of the Bible are used in connection with this "teaching"?&lt;br /&gt;First Rev. 12:6  is used to establish "3 and a half times" = 1260 DAYS.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Then this is doubled to represent the 7 times in the book of Daniel.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Then the supposed "Bible rule" of a day for a year is taken from the book of Numbers and Ezekiel.&lt;br /&gt;These scriptures are used arbitrarily and without instruction from the Bible itself to construct a very shaky "mathematically" based doctrine which is built upon a event which did not take place in the year 607 B.C.E. but rather twenty years later in the year 587 B.C.E.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;But there is more. What does the Governing Body say about the verse in Rev. 12:6 in their most recent explanation of the book of Revelation?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;" How long did this respite for the seed of God’s woman last? Revelation 12:6 says 1,260 days. Revelation 12:14 calls the period a time, times, and half a time; in other words, three and a half times. In fact, both expressions stand for three and a half years, &lt;span style="color: red;"&gt;extending in the Northern Hemisphere from the spring of 1919 to the autumn of 1922&lt;/span&gt;. This was a period of refreshing recuperation and reorganization for the restored John class."&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Do you notice how the Current teaching from the book Jehovah's Witnesses have just studied recently, applies it?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;This book  says it applies to a literal period of time during the early part of the last century.  Without this one scripture there is no 2520 days, no 7 times and no 1914. So why have the Governing Body said that this was fulfilled in the above quote?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Moreover does it seem reasonable to apply this VERY SAME  scripture to a period supposedly beginning some 2500 years in the past (607 B.C.E.) and then give another completely unrelated application of it in a modern day setting (1919-1922) in LITERAL DAYS?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Where is the scriptural imperative that allows for anyone to do this?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Also worth noting is that the years that they are talking about are special "Watchtower prophetic years"  They abandon the normal use of lunar years in  Bible prophecy ( i.e. 360 days in each year)  in favour of solar years (i.e. 365 days) again in a completely arbitrary fashion.&lt;br /&gt;Since these numbers  are from the Bible it would be only fair to count  years the way the Bible does , in increments  of 360 days each.&lt;br /&gt;So  with  607 b.c.e. as a starting date and counting 2520 years (Bible lunar)  it only brings you to 1878 a.d. , a date of no significance today in JW doctrine. So they have "stretched out" the prophecy to suit their 1914 date by using years of 365 days each.&lt;br /&gt;Whatever way you choose to examine the date 1914 in witness doctrine it is seriously flawed and remember it's not just a date in a so-called "prophecy", the JW's whole belief system and authority rests upon it. A very shaky foundation indeed. A house built upon the sand?&lt;br /&gt;Of course the import of all of this is huge in terms of the very foundation on which Jehovah's Witnesses base their faith. A faith which turns out to be based not on  the Bible , but on the organisation itself and it's dogmatic, enforced teachings.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Without 1914 and it's associated doctrines they have no special meaning as an organisation and no special message to deliver that is distinct from any other "Christian " group.&lt;br /&gt;The way that 1914 is arrived at is completely arbitrary from a Biblical perspective, but this is overlooked by all who profess to believe, as the "appointment" of the WTBTS and it's leaders is solely contingent on them being correct about this belief.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;As I stated before in my experience&amp;nbsp;many of the younger generation and perhaps some older ones, do not really&amp;nbsp;place too much emphasis on the&amp;nbsp;doctrines or the year 1914. The how or the why they believe what they do is not a&amp;nbsp;chief concern, rather maintaining their status quo is mostly what it's all about as a Jehovah's Witness.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: times new roman;"&gt;How many times are they going to be challenged about the accuracy and truth of their doctrines in their door-knocking work these days? Not&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;very much is the &amp;nbsp;likelihood.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family: times new roman;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Suppose  you did care though  and you wanted to question what you were actually being asked to believe both from a scriptural  or an historical , not to mention logical perspective?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;You would be met with a gasp of disbelief and a very troubled looking face looking back at you asking if you are questioning the "slave class" on this issue?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Think about it logically, if the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society Inc. and it's Governing Body  accepted  that they were completely wrong about the 1914 doctrine then where would that leave them?&lt;br /&gt;Remember they are a Corporation, a business. Their whole ethos is built upon the assumption that Jesus , shortly after establishing his kingdom in 1914 appointed their leaders as his sole representatives on earth.&lt;br /&gt;So it follows that if they are wrong about their 1914 doctrine then they most certainly are not his representatives on earth and never will be as  this quote from the Watchtower demonstrates:-&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;*** w91 12/1 p. 7 Is Any Religion Good Enough? ***&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;How to Choose the Right Religion&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;What will guide us in choosing the right religion? The Encyclopædia Universalis is correct when it highlights the importance of truth.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="color: red;"&gt; "A religion that teaches lies cannot be true." &lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;So where does this leave a faithful Witness then? They can choose to serve the organisation knowing that it teaches falsehood and demands that it's followers obey or they can take a stand  refusing to give any more of their life to a lost cause. It may be difficult as many, like my self have former friends and family in the group, but it can be done with some strength of character&amp;nbsp;, a bit of investigation coupled with a determination to find the truth about what Jehovah's Witnesses teach.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Ask yourself ; is finding out the truth about the&amp;nbsp;teachings you have perhaps spent many years believing&amp;nbsp; hard to take? Yes of course!&lt;br /&gt;But wanting or needing something to be true  when it plainly isn't does not make it any less of a lie.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span style="color: #888888;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="color: #888888;"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span style="color: #888888;"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/3850995487033495036-3731494057155669667?l=deathorobedience.blogspot.com' alt='' /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/feeds/3731494057155669667/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2011/04/1914-honest-evaluation.html#comment-form' title='4 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/3731494057155669667'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/3731494057155669667'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2011/04/1914-honest-evaluation.html' title='1914 an honest evaluation.'/><author><name>Matthew</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08413266173326117804</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='32' height='32' src='http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_bXMuq_iFQxU/SdDRD7-p3xI/AAAAAAAAAB0/U0Meh0Y2nIs/S220/itunes.jpg'/></author><thr:total>4</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3850995487033495036.post-318326997972780127</id><published>2011-01-31T08:08:00.000-08:00</published><updated>2011-01-31T08:16:42.163-08:00</updated><title type='text'>The Watchtower and the United Nations</title><content type='html'>One of the visually better-put-together websites supporting the WTS’s stand on its 10-year relationship with the United Nations is The Watchtower Society as a United Nations NGO – A Look at the Conspiracy Theory  (&lt;a href="http://www.thirdwitness.com/UN/www.jehovahsjudgment.co.uk/watchtower-un-ngo/questions.html"&gt;http://www.thirdwitness.com/UN/www.jehovahsjudgment.co.uk/watchtower-un-ngo/questions.html&lt;/a&gt;).&lt;br /&gt;Once you’re past the visuals, however, and you begin to read it, the site’s agenda becomes clear. Apart from the unnamed author’(s’) predilection towards finger-pointing pejorative words and phrases, such as ‘apostate,’ there seems to be some quite dodgy reasoning. Rather than read through predictable spin on the subject, I fast-forwarded to the “Miscellaneous Questions” page and to one particularly interesting point.&lt;br /&gt;The author asks: Doesn’t the Watchtower teach that the UN is the unclean thing and should not be touched?&lt;br /&gt;No, he answers.&lt;br /&gt;Technically this is true if you factor in that 2 Corinthians 6:16-18 refers to religious things. However, despite the author’s apparent attempt to demonstrate that the WTS has, albeit a tenuous respect, for the existence and the work of the UN, he appears to be oblivious quotes such as this:&lt;br /&gt;‘What “disgusting thing” has been “put in place” in modern times? Apparently, it is a “disgusting” counterfeit of God’s Kingdom. This was the League of Nations, the scarlet-colored wild beast that went into the abyss, or ceased to exist as a world-peace organization when World War 11 erupted. (Revelation 17:8) The “wild beast,” however, was to “ascend out of the abyss.” This it did when the United Nations, the 50 member nations including the former Soviet Union, was established on October 24, 1945. Thus “the disgusting thing” foretold by an angel – the United Nations – was put in place.’ – Page 269, paragraph 24, Pay Attention to Daniel’s Prophecy!, published by the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society, 1999.&lt;br /&gt;Most Witnesses will know that the Scriptural reference referring to not ‘touching the unclean thing’ applies to Babylon the Great which they are taught to view as the ‘World Empire of False Religion.’&lt;br /&gt;Is the author then suggesting that ‘infiltrating’ by use of the UN’s libraries was ethically acceptable?&lt;br /&gt;Notice, too, that its publication date is 7 years before the saga began and only 3 years before it ended.&lt;br /&gt;Related to this is a further question on the site: Although there was nothing technically wrong with being an NGO with the DPI in 1992, should the Watchtower have not avoided anything to do with the United Nations to avoid stumbling the brothers?&lt;br /&gt;To this question the author likewise answers No.&lt;br /&gt;The fact is the action did cause a major stumbling when the news was exposed (within 24 hours of the newspaper article is bound to raise eyebrows!) While most Witnesses would have to meet their end with a millstone around their necks for ‘stumbling their brothers,’ it seems that others are exempt.&lt;br /&gt;Ethically, what happened would be like us asking Adolf Hitler if you could use the Reichstag library during World War Two to write anti-Nazi propaganda leaflets.&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/3850995487033495036-318326997972780127?l=deathorobedience.blogspot.com' alt='' /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/feeds/318326997972780127/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2011/01/watchtower-and-united-nations.html#comment-form' title='2 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/318326997972780127'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/318326997972780127'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2011/01/watchtower-and-united-nations.html' title='The Watchtower and the United Nations'/><author><name>Matthew</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08413266173326117804</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='32' height='32' src='http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_bXMuq_iFQxU/SdDRD7-p3xI/AAAAAAAAAB0/U0Meh0Y2nIs/S220/itunes.jpg'/></author><thr:total>2</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3850995487033495036.post-7961587888161176686</id><published>2010-12-25T06:01:00.000-08:00</published><updated>2011-01-07T11:38:43.362-08:00</updated><title type='text'>A look at the ethics of Jehovah's Witnesses.</title><content type='html'>This post is to expose the unethical, un-scriptural actions of the men involved in the "judicial" processes of jehovah's Witneses. The lack of fair minded impartial justice shown to me during my "judicial" case is a result of what they (the elders) are directed to do by the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesess. I am not alone of course. Many people have been through similar and will do again in the future, sadly. I hope that those who read this study in it's entirety will acknowledge that what they put people through is wrong on many levels. As you read I hope you will recognise they are seriously flawed in their methods also.&lt;br /&gt;This study has been kindly and painstakingly put together at great effort by an anonymous person who I believe is an active Jehovah's Witness, but feels very strongly about this particular issue. He has given me permission to publish what he has written on his behalf.&lt;br /&gt;The full study is available &lt;a href="http://thegoverningbody.org/files/ethics.pdf"&gt;here&lt;/a&gt; to read and I would strongly recommend all to read it. It is a wonderfully well written, well researched and well thought out peice of work. The logic employed is very difficult to refute. Written not as an attack on JWs in any way it brilliantly points out step by step where the author feels things went wrong. I hope you enjoy it.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;a href="http://thegoverningbody.org/files/ethics.pdf "&gt;Study of Jehovah's witness ethics&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Matthew &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;"The purpose of this essay is for the education of others who may find themselves part of this arrangement one day, and for stimulating constructive discussion on the content of this judicial case and its methodology. If you agree with the views expounded, tell us why . If you wish to challenge the opinions stated, that's fine also - tell us why, and be ready to have those views challenged. This is a forum for honest discussion and your comments are appreciated. Engage the author, engage Matthew, engage this philosophy." - The Author&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/3850995487033495036-7961587888161176686?l=deathorobedience.blogspot.com' alt='' /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/feeds/7961587888161176686/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2010/12/look-at-ethics-of-jehovahs-witnesses.html#comment-form' title='6 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/7961587888161176686'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/7961587888161176686'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2010/12/look-at-ethics-of-jehovahs-witnesses.html' title='A look at the ethics of Jehovah&apos;s Witnesses.'/><author><name>Matthew</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08413266173326117804</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='32' height='32' src='http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_bXMuq_iFQxU/SdDRD7-p3xI/AAAAAAAAAB0/U0Meh0Y2nIs/S220/itunes.jpg'/></author><thr:total>6</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3850995487033495036.post-805914412971065394</id><published>2010-11-28T15:28:00.000-08:00</published><updated>2010-11-28T15:46:46.921-08:00</updated><title type='text'>Full transcripts</title><content type='html'>There are now full transcripts availabe of Podcasts 8-12 which are the judicial hearings and a conversation with an elder at the Kingdom hall.&lt;br /&gt;These have been kindly provided by an anonymous donor.&lt;br /&gt;This helps people who may have trouble with their hearing or cannot understand some of the Scottish accents.&lt;br /&gt;They are available on the link below and have audio links to listen as you read.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;a href="http://jehovahswitnesstrial.wordpress.com/"&gt;http://jehovahswitnesstrial.wordpress.com/&lt;/a&gt;&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/3850995487033495036-805914412971065394?l=deathorobedience.blogspot.com' alt='' /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/feeds/805914412971065394/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2010/11/full-transcripts.html#comment-form' title='1 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/805914412971065394'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/805914412971065394'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2010/11/full-transcripts.html' title='Full transcripts'/><author><name>Matthew</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08413266173326117804</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='32' height='32' src='http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_bXMuq_iFQxU/SdDRD7-p3xI/AAAAAAAAAB0/U0Meh0Y2nIs/S220/itunes.jpg'/></author><thr:total>1</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3850995487033495036.post-3931521795351114000</id><published>2010-03-08T16:15:00.000-08:00</published><updated>2010-03-09T11:31:38.642-08:00</updated><title type='text'>Appeal letter to London Bethel</title><content type='html'>Dear brothers,&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I Understand that there was an announcement to the effect that I, Matthew Barrie am no longer considered to be one of Jehovah's Witnesses on 05/02/09 at Bishopbriggs Kingdom Hall.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I am reliably informed that the brother in question , Ronnie Moffat, was concerned that in order for there to be no breach of confidentiality he acted without the knowledge of the majority of the rest of the body of elders when he made the above announcement.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I am also reliably informed that  other members of the body assumed that the announcement would be on  the 12th of February 2009.&lt;br /&gt; &lt;br /&gt;This is however, in my view surely the most serious breach of my confidentiality there could possibly be.&lt;br /&gt;To the best of my knowledge I have the right of appeal by letter to the appeal committee within seven days of the appeal being heard. And yet while I am preparing my appeal letter It is disclosed  only four days after the appeal that not only that I am under judicial action, but that I've actually been disfellowshipped! &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;In my view there can only be two explanations for this situation:-&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;1.I have no right of appeal and therefore the brother was right to act as he did.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;2.I do have the right of appeal but the brothers on the appeal committee chose not to inform me of that right, and therefore the announcement should not have been made.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;This is a very serious matter. Is it fair and reasonable to assume that the person being accused is aware of all his rights and should know what to do or say at all times?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I would kindly like to point out to the brothers that I requested by letter ,dated 18/01/09 before any of the judicial meetings had taken place to be informed of what my rights  and responsibilities were should the matter be taken to an appeal committee. (ref. point 18) For the brothers to ignore this request and refuse either the right of appeal itself or not to inform me of my rights or responsibilities is a serious and flagrant disregard for both my legal rights and  more importantly Theocratic Justice. Is is not the case that one of Jehovah's cardinal qualities is Justice?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I would like to state for the record that in my view this case has been mishandled from start to finish, to the extent that I could not possibly receive a fair trial. I will outline below  why I feel this to be so.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;1. A number of the body of elders in Bishopbriggs have demonstrated knowledge of the proceedings against me and have passed that knowledge on to several publishers not connected to the case.&lt;br /&gt;They have shown that they are predisposed to the possibility of me being removed from the congregation.&lt;br /&gt; The men I have specific knowledge of are Lee Green snr ,Gordon Harper and most worryingly Ronald Hunter ,who was one of the accusers.&lt;br /&gt;I have Witnesses of these actions of all of the above named.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;2.Ronald Hunter went on a "shepherding" visit to Anne Byrne and discussed private and judicial matters relating to my case with her and Susan Hunter his wife ,who was also present. He then made several False accusations to Anne Byrne relating to me ,of which there are also two  witnesses.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;3.Ronald Hunter then attended a further "shepherding" visit to Peter and Nan Barrie with Ronnie Moffat.&lt;br /&gt;Is it fair that my Judge/juror  in the shape of Ronnie Moffat would undertake a  visit with  one of my accusers Ronald Hunter to gather evidence against me from my parents?(January 2009) Surely it must be recognized that this is contrary to natural justice? How can Ronnie Moffat sit as chairman of my committee and purport to be impartial?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;4.When it came to my attention that Ronald Hunter had said some serious things about me and my family which in my view amounted to slander I followed Matt . 18.15 and went to speak with him.(25/12/08)&lt;br /&gt;This visit was unproductive as brother Hunter refused to answer some questions, and couldn't remember having made the statements to Anne Byrne. He then made a false accusation to my face that I had been teaching her falsehoods.I had done no such thing and had little or no contact with her and certainly no doctrinal discussions. Following Ronald Hunter's visit Anne Byrne was very upset and has now disassociated herself from Jehovah's Witnesses.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;5.During the first judicial  after I was sent out I could not help but overhear brother Hunter in another room making sweeping  hurtful statements about other young persons who are connected to the local Hall, in which he states what is clear to him about their life course and motivation. During this discussion he tries to influence the other witness Paul Barrie by saying that an honest question I had asked of brother Barrie during the hearing was "twisted, and the mark of an "apostate".&lt;br /&gt; &lt;br /&gt;6.The testimony of brother Hunter was that I "believe" all the subjects that were discussed in the shepherding visits. At no time did I forcefully state that. Also  by way of example  during the course of  brother Hunter's testimony He states that "Matthew made it very clear that all must partake of the emblems at the memorial if they want to be saved".  I have carefully reviewed the evidence and consulted with my wife and  I have  a record of all the conversations I have had which involve Ronald Hunter.Unfortunately I cannot find any evidence to support  brother Hunter's assertive statement.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt; Can I kindly point out that although Ronald Hunter and the other brothers concerned are elders, the scripture in Proverbs 6.16-18 applies with equal force to all of us.&lt;br /&gt; There are six things that Jehovah does hate; yes, seven are things detestable to his soul:  lofty eyes, a false tongue, and hands that are shedding innocent blood,  a heart fabricating hurtful schemes, feet that are in a hurry to run to badness,  a false witness that launches forth lies, and anyone sending forth contentions among brothers. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;In my view given the circumstances and handling of this case and the behaviour, speech and attitudes displayed by some of the brothers involved I can only ask that the case against me be dropped .&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;There is no evidence against me from anyone else in the congregation and in fact the evidence I presented showed that I was being commended  by both accusers for keeping any private views I may  hold to myself.One of the brothers ,Paul Barrie said recently that he had no problem with me talking to him "because if you can't talk to the elders then who can you talk to?" I also have evidence which Lee Green Snr  is aware of that I  very recently refused to discuss any views I may hold with my good friend , his son who is a JW.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt; The fact that I did want to discuss My personal view with either committee is not evidence of being an "apostate", rather an entirely reasonable reaction to the situation where the elders tried to use shepherding settings to obtain and use information in a judicial environment on the premise that they were there to help.&lt;br /&gt; &lt;br /&gt;I also feel that brother Hunter's testimony should be dismissed based on the above evidence. Matthew !8;16 says that every matter should be established "at the mouth of two or three witnesses"  In my view brother Hunter would be removed as a credible witness if this was a court of law, which would leave Paul Barrie as the sole accuser.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Surely, if as Jehovah's Witnesses believe, a person's eternal salvation is at stake this should be of the utmost importance? &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I hope that this can be settled amicably at this time as I   didn't ask for this situation to arise. It is my hope that this matter can be resolved without me needing to take things any further.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Since the brothers were so eager to announce that I am no longer one of Jehovah's Witnesses I would be happy for them to make an announcement as soon as possible to the contrary.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I await your consideration of my letter of appeal and pray that the Holy Spirit will lead you to make the correct decision .&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Yours ,&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Matthew J. Barrie.&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/3850995487033495036-3931521795351114000?l=deathorobedience.blogspot.com' alt='' /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/feeds/3931521795351114000/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2010/03/appeal-letter-to-london-bethel.html#comment-form' title='23 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/3931521795351114000'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/3931521795351114000'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2010/03/appeal-letter-to-london-bethel.html' title='Appeal letter to London Bethel'/><author><name>Matthew</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08413266173326117804</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='32' height='32' src='http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_bXMuq_iFQxU/SdDRD7-p3xI/AAAAAAAAAB0/U0Meh0Y2nIs/S220/itunes.jpg'/></author><thr:total>23</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3850995487033495036.post-1007893747358593035</id><published>2010-02-18T10:16:00.000-08:00</published><updated>2010-02-18T10:33:46.780-08:00</updated><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='disfellowshipped'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='sins'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='bible'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='judicial'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='jesus.'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='worship'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='apostasy'/><title type='text'>Podcast 12- The final verdict.</title><content type='html'>&lt;a href="http://media.libsyn.com/media/tartanpodcast/doro12.mp3"&gt;play the audio&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;This is the last part of the podcast series which charts the so called "&lt;span id="SPELLING_ERROR_0" class="blsp-spelling-corrected"&gt;judicial&lt;/span&gt;" process.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Remember the decision that is reached impacts a persons family and social circle and perhaps their livelihood and ultimately as Jehovah's Witnesses believe their life itself, in the event they term "&lt;span id="SPELLING_ERROR_1" class="blsp-spelling-corrected"&gt;Armageddon&lt;/span&gt;".&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;This decision is meant to be just and fair and arrived at by means of the Holy Spirit directing these men's actions. The Bible should also be the ultimate source to determine a person's wrongdoing in situations such as these.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Please listen and make your own judgement.&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/3850995487033495036-1007893747358593035?l=deathorobedience.blogspot.com' alt='' /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/feeds/1007893747358593035/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2010/02/podcast-12-final-verdict.html#comment-form' title='6 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/1007893747358593035'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/1007893747358593035'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2010/02/podcast-12-final-verdict.html' title='Podcast 12- The final verdict.'/><author><name>Matthew</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08413266173326117804</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='32' height='32' src='http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_bXMuq_iFQxU/SdDRD7-p3xI/AAAAAAAAAB0/U0Meh0Y2nIs/S220/itunes.jpg'/></author><thr:total>6</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3850995487033495036.post-1399159538902642262</id><published>2010-02-02T09:21:00.000-08:00</published><updated>2010-02-19T15:38:16.393-08:00</updated><title type='text'>Podcast 11- Judicial Committee Appeal</title><content type='html'>&lt;strong&gt;&lt;a href="http://media.libsyn.com/media/tartanpodcast/doro_11.mp3"&gt;Play, download, share.&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;This &lt;a href="http://media.libsyn.com/media/tartanpodcast/doro_11.mp3"&gt;Podcast &lt;/a&gt;is the first of three which chronicle the so called "Judicial appeal". You will hear the charges against me re-outlined by the committee of 3 high profile elders from the Lanarkshire Number 1 Circuit, including &lt;strong&gt;Philip Jones&lt;/strong&gt;, &lt;strong&gt;Ian Shanks&lt;/strong&gt; and chairman&lt;strong&gt; Martin Benzie&lt;/strong&gt;. All 3 'brothers' have served, or are currently serving, as Circuit Overseers.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;You may be interested to hear how Brother Jones describes what the Gospel is. Compare his description of it  with the Gospel preached by Jesus and the 1st Century congregation. Then read Galations 1:6-8.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Judge for yourself whether these Christians are more interested in God, Christ and the Bible or the Organisation.&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/3850995487033495036-1399159538902642262?l=deathorobedience.blogspot.com' alt='' /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/feeds/1399159538902642262/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2010/02/podcast-11-judicial-committee-appeal.html#comment-form' title='6 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/1399159538902642262'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/1399159538902642262'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2010/02/podcast-11-judicial-committee-appeal.html' title='Podcast 11- Judicial Committee Appeal'/><author><name>Matthew</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08413266173326117804</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='32' height='32' src='http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_bXMuq_iFQxU/SdDRD7-p3xI/AAAAAAAAAB0/U0Meh0Y2nIs/S220/itunes.jpg'/></author><thr:total>6</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3850995487033495036.post-4320623659185482532</id><published>2009-07-30T14:31:00.000-07:00</published><updated>2009-08-02T10:59:32.914-07:00</updated><title type='text'>Podcast 10 - Disfellowshipped For?</title><content type='html'>&lt;a href="http://media.libsyn.com/media/tartanpodcast/doro_10.mp3"&gt;Play the audio&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;This podcast concludes my first judicial hearing.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Remember, I was expected to defend myself in front of a committee of 3 elders with no representation; it was me against them. The two witness called to testify against me were both elders, one of whom is my brother. Both of these witnesses used conversations I had had with them, trusting that they were going to help me. Instead, they convened a meeting of the elders, brought their testimonies together and formed a judicial committee. This was a breach of clergy privilege.*&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Please pay careful attention to what can only be described as a personal bias on the part of one of the elders in the committee who was supposed to have been going on holiday with two of our friends.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Compare his questioning, coupled with the testimony of the two elders, with the statement made right at the end by the Chairman that the committee was not prejudiced or biased.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Also, notice how attending other churches is grounds for disfellowshipping. This is a direct contravention of Article 18 of the United Nations Declaration for Human Rights. Click here for more information;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;a href="http://www.un.org/en/documents/udhr/"&gt;http://www.un.org/en/documents/udhr/&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Remember, anyone who does not accept all of the Governing Body's interpretation of scripture is liable to face a committee such as I did.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Ask yourself whether the Watch Tower Society allows it's members to enjoy the same level of freedom of thought and religion as it itself expects to be afforded.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Is there any wonder why some view the Watch Tower Society as a dangerous cult?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;*Jehovah's Witness elders consistently use the excuse of "clergy privilege" to avoid having to testify in court against suspected Jehovah's Witness pedophiles. Please check &lt;a href="http://www.silentlambs.org/"&gt;www.silentlambs.org&lt;/a&gt; for further information."&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/3850995487033495036-4320623659185482532?l=deathorobedience.blogspot.com' alt='' /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/feeds/4320623659185482532/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/07/play-audio-this-podcast-concludes-my.html#comment-form' title='2 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/4320623659185482532'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/4320623659185482532'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/07/play-audio-this-podcast-concludes-my.html' title='Podcast 10 - Disfellowshipped For?'/><author><name>Matthew</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08413266173326117804</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='32' height='32' src='http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_bXMuq_iFQxU/SdDRD7-p3xI/AAAAAAAAAB0/U0Meh0Y2nIs/S220/itunes.jpg'/></author><thr:total>2</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3850995487033495036.post-5967060790623775004</id><published>2009-07-20T12:42:00.000-07:00</published><updated>2009-07-20T12:50:08.215-07:00</updated><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='disfellowshipping'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='judicial'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='apostasy'/><title type='text'>Podcast 9 - The "hearing" begins.</title><content type='html'>&lt;a href="http://media.libsyn.com/media/tartanpodcast/doro_9.mp3"&gt;PLAY THE AUDIO&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;In this edition of the podcast we start the first of my judicial hearings. This is part 1 of the first hearing.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I'll let the audio speak for itself, however, please notice who the two witnesses are and how apostasy is defined when I ask what the charge means in real terms.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Please feel free to copy and distribute these podcasts. If you've any comments, please leave them on the website;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;a href="http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com"&gt;www.deathorobedience.blogspot.com&lt;/a&gt;&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/3850995487033495036-5967060790623775004?l=deathorobedience.blogspot.com' alt='' /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/feeds/5967060790623775004/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/07/podcast-9-hearing-begins.html#comment-form' title='6 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/5967060790623775004'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/5967060790623775004'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/07/podcast-9-hearing-begins.html' title='Podcast 9 - The &quot;hearing&quot; begins.'/><author><name>Matthew</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08413266173326117804</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='32' height='32' src='http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_bXMuq_iFQxU/SdDRD7-p3xI/AAAAAAAAAB0/U0Meh0Y2nIs/S220/itunes.jpg'/></author><thr:total>6</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3850995487033495036.post-1714634582565442791</id><published>2009-06-01T17:35:00.000-07:00</published><updated>2009-06-01T17:46:27.770-07:00</updated><title type='text'>Podcast 8- Showdown at the Kingdom Hall</title><content type='html'>&lt;div style="margin: 0px;"&gt;&lt;a href="http://media.libsyn.com/media/tartanpodcast/doro_8.mp3"&gt;Play the audio&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;If you cannot open the file ,  get it free on itunes. Click on the link below.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;a href="http://itunes.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewPodcast?id=310612127"&gt;itunes link&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div style="margin: 0px; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div style="margin: 0px;"&gt;This podcast was recorded on Christmas Day 2008.&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div style="margin: 0px; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div style="margin: 0px;"&gt;After our last visit from two local elders my wife felt she could no longer be known as a Jehovah's Witness and had chosen to disassociate herself in November 2008.&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div style="margin: 0px; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div style="margin: 0px;"&gt;We had been on a family holiday and had returned to find that one of the local elders who had visited us had warned off my mother-in-law from having anything to do with my wife - her daughter. He also made false statements about one of my children.&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div style="margin: 0px; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div style="margin: 0px;"&gt;I decided to confront this elder at the Kingdom Hall. This podcast is the recording of our conversation.&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div style="margin: 0px; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div style="margin: 0px;"&gt;Notice how he denies making  such statements to my mother-in-law and falsely accuses me of teaching her beliefs contrary to Jehovah's Witnesses.&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div style="margin: 0px; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div style="margin: 0px;"&gt;I ask whether it's a sin to no longer be a Jehovah's Witness?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt; He also clearly states his position regarding the worship of Jesus.&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div style="margin: 0px; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div style="margin: 0px;"&gt;I firmly believe that as a result  of this conversation this elder initiated judicial proceedings against me the following month. &lt;/div&gt;&lt;div style="margin: 0px; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div style="margin: 0px;"&gt;Podcasts from this judicial hearing will follow shortly.&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div style="margin: 0px; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/3850995487033495036-1714634582565442791?l=deathorobedience.blogspot.com' alt='' /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/feeds/1714634582565442791/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/06/podcast-8-showdown-at-kingdom-hall.html#comment-form' title='15 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/1714634582565442791'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/1714634582565442791'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/06/podcast-8-showdown-at-kingdom-hall.html' title='Podcast 8- Showdown at the Kingdom Hall'/><author><name>Matthew</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08413266173326117804</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='32' height='32' src='http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_bXMuq_iFQxU/SdDRD7-p3xI/AAAAAAAAAB0/U0Meh0Y2nIs/S220/itunes.jpg'/></author><thr:total>15</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3850995487033495036.post-7304330778095374386</id><published>2009-05-16T15:06:00.000-07:00</published><updated>2009-05-21T10:15:17.319-07:00</updated><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='Kyrios'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='NWT'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='bible'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='Translation'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='Greek'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='New world'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='Lord'/><title type='text'>New World Translation examined</title><content type='html'>"The "New world" translation is the finest translation there is".&lt;br /&gt;This is a phrase that a Jehovah's Witnesses will either hear said many times, or read in the publications.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;When I attended an intensive study and teaching course  serving as a "pioneer" (in the Door to Door work) ,the book which we used&lt;br /&gt;had a whole chapter dedicated to the "Effective use of the NWT" .&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;This chapter from the "&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_0"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_0"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_0"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_0"&gt;Illuminators&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;" book asks  on  page100 ;  "Why was the NWT needed in the first place?" One of the answers given was :-  "The honest-hearted need help to comprehend correctly the Bible's teachings"&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Also this statement is made..."The NWT is a completely new translation unfettered by Christendom's  religious traditions"&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;And ....."It is especially appreciated since it was translated directly from Hebrew , Aramaic and Greek"&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Let us examine these three quotes and determine whether they are accurate statements.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;How have the "honest-hearted" managed without the NWT for the best part of 2000 years? Is it fair to claim that persons reading the Bible would not be able to understand what they were reading and would fail to see the Bible's "teachings" until  circa 1960 A.D.?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;These comments are of course to reinforce the notion that this "translation" is &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-corrected" id="SPELLING_ERROR_1"&gt;indispensable&lt;/span&gt; to serious Bible students and anyone who regards themselves as honest-hearted. And the "help" comes from reading  the NWT as opposed to other Bibles.  The NWT  was produced by an  &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-corrected" id="SPELLING_ERROR_2"&gt;anonymous&lt;/span&gt; group of people in the 1950's and 60's.&lt;br /&gt;Some of these same people consider themselves to be God's "Channel of communication on earth" , so it would follow that their Bible would also be considered to  have God's approval.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Let us look at one example to see if the "Bible's teachings" are adhered to and expounded clearly.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Please look at Hebrews 1:6 "But when he again brings his Firstborn into the inhabited earth, he says: “And let all God’s angels do obeisance to him.”- New World &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-corrected" id="SPELLING_ERROR_3"&gt;Translation&lt;/span&gt;.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;What are the honest-hearted being told here about Jesus? They are being told that the Angels do "obeisance" to him.&lt;br /&gt;However when we look at the footnote  in their reference Bible  for Heb. 1:6 we see that it is the Greek word  used is &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_4"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_1"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_1"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_1"&gt;proskuneo&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; and should actually  be rendered "let WORSHIP" as it appears in many other translations.  In the 1961 NWT it IS  rendered "worship" but in the next revision (1971)  it was removed for reasons known to this &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-corrected" id="SPELLING_ERROR_2"&gt;anonymous&lt;/span&gt; group.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Are the the "honest hearted" being helped to "comprehend"  Bible truth?&lt;br /&gt;The Watchtower Society (WTS)  do not want to encourage the worship of Jesus in any way, a fact born out by the blatant removal of the word worship from this verse. So is  manipulating the way a verse is translated  acceptable, when the verse conveys a thought that is alien to the belief system one holds? I would have thought not.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Let us look at the second statement."The NWT is a completely new translation unfettered by Christendom's  religious traditions".&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;This may well be an accurate statement to make as the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_6"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_3"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_4"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_3"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; often adopt a position which is contrary to "Christendom" even if it cannot be substantiated , such as Jesus dying on a stake not a cross. So we would expect this same criteria to be applied in their NWT.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Is it fair though to say that your translation is unfettered by any religious "entity" such as "Christendom" while at the same time being heavily influenced  or "fettered" by your OWN  doctrinal bias?&lt;br /&gt;Here is a quote from the Watchtower which represents how this actually works in real terms.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Watchtower 1986 4/1 p. 31&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;"Approved association with Jehovah’s Witnesses requires accepting the entire range of the true teachings of the Bible, including those Scriptural beliefs that are unique to Jehovah’s Witnesses. What do such beliefs include?&lt;br /&gt;That there is a “faithful and discreet slave” upon earth today ‘entrusted with all of Jesus’ earthly interests,’ which slave is associated with the Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses."(end of quote)&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Notice how the Bible's true  "teachings" are actually qualified by  those beliefs which are "unique" to Jehovah's Witnesses?&lt;br /&gt;So what this means is that the doctrinal and belief system of &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_7"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_4"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_5"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_4"&gt;JWs&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;  such as the "faithful Slave" dogma are ,according to them, the REAL message of the Bible as  interpreted by the Governing Body. Is this not exactly what the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_8"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_5"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_6"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_5"&gt;wts&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; are claiming the NWT is free from?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Now let us consider the  third quote:- "It is especially appreciated since it was translated directly from Hebrew , Aramaic and Greek"&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;While it is true that the NWT is translated   from these ancient languages this statement  gives the impression that the NWT  always uses the oldest and most accurate manuscripts available and again  that there is little room for manipulation.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Here is the quote from the foreword from the 1951 NWT:-&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;"The original writings of the Christian Greek Scriptures, commonly called the New Testament, were inspired. No translation of these Sacred writings into another language, is inspired... The Greek text that we have used as a basis of our NW translation is the widely accepted &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_9"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_6"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_7"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_6"&gt;Westcott&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; and Hort text (1881) by reason of its admitted excellence.But we have also taken in to consideration other texts including that prepared by D. Eberhard Nestle and that compiled by the Spanish Jesuit scholar Jose Maria &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_10"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_7"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_8"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_7"&gt;Bover&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; and that by the other Jesuit scholar A. &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_11"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_8"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_9"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_8"&gt;Merk&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;..."&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The New world translation does not always  use   the oldest and most accurate manuscripts. So the question must be asked did they actually follow the ancient Greek text established by "Christendom's  scholars, as they claim? No they did not. They threw in &lt;em&gt;another &lt;/em&gt;series of later peculiar documents which have nothing to do with scholarly textual criticism because they are not witnesses to the ancient Greek text. Some of these "sources"  happen to have included the name "Jehovah" or &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_12"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_9"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_10"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_9"&gt;YHWH&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;.  Also of note is the fact that two  named Jesuit Scholars   (a high order of the Catholic Church)   worked on  the original Greek manuscripts to produce a  translation  which the society have drawn from for the NWT.  These people are part of the very entity they repudiate in the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_10"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_11"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_10"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; publications. So  these sources , i. e.  the Catholic Church are viable when it suits their purposes and vehemently condemned  at other times. Is this not somewhat hypocritical?&lt;br /&gt;Does this sound like the NWT is "unfettered" by Christendom's teachings?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Have a look in the NWT  footnotes and you will see the  proliferation of the letter "J" , these are the instances where they have utilised   "manuscripts" and  "sources" ranging from the 1500's to 1981.  Usually where the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-corrected" id="SPELLING_ERROR_13"&gt;Greek&lt;/span&gt; word for "Lord"(Kyrios) or God (Theos) would  appear, the name Jehovah has been inserted in  their place , thus "restoring" the Divine name to it's "rightful" place in the Greek scriptures. This has been done 237 times in the new testament of the New World Translation.&lt;br /&gt;The oldest available Greek manuscripts do not contain YHWH at all, other than the expression "hallelujah" which appears  in Revelation 19:3.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;However a striking example of the translators doctrinal bias , hypocrisy and hiding the true message of the Bible is found at 1Thessalonians 4:15,16. in the NWT.&lt;br /&gt;" For this is what we tell you by &lt;span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);"&gt;Jehovah’s&lt;/span&gt; word, that we the living who survive to the presence of the &lt;span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);"&gt;Lord&lt;/span&gt; shall in no way precede those who have fallen asleep [in death];  because the&lt;span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);"&gt; Lord&lt;/span&gt; himself will descend from heaven with a commanding call, with an archangel’s voice and with God’s trumpet, and those who are dead in union with Christ will rise first."&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;In the above verses the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-corrected" id="SPELLING_ERROR_14"&gt;Greek&lt;/span&gt; word &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_15"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_11"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_12"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_11"&gt;Kyrios&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; or Lord in &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-corrected" id="SPELLING_ERROR_16"&gt;English&lt;/span&gt;, appears 3 times in the oldest Greek manuscripts. (highlighted).&lt;br /&gt;In verse 15 we see that the  NWT translators have used the name Jehovah in place of lord in the phrase "Jehovah's word" when in the Greek manuscripts it is "&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_17"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_12"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_13"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_12"&gt;kyrios&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;" or Lord.&lt;br /&gt;The "J" manuscript uses Jehovah here so that is the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_18"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_13"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_14"&gt;NWT translation&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; basis for including it . The NWT translation  committee  proudly say they have restored the divine name to it's rightful place. Please look to the very next verse (16). The Greek word &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_19"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_14"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_15"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_13"&gt;Kyrios&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; is now rendered "Lord" instead of Jehovah. If you again check the footnote of the reference bible you will notice that  the "J" source translation has indeed rendered the name Jehovah , just as in  the preceding verse. And yet now  the preferred manuscript is  &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_20"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_15"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_16"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_14"&gt;ABVg&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; which uses "&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_17"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_15"&gt;kyrios&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;" or Lord.&lt;br /&gt;So why  have the NWT translation &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-corrected" id="SPELLING_ERROR_21"&gt;Committee&lt;/span&gt; decided that the Divine name  "Jehovah" is now surplus to requirements?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The answer is doctrinal bias.  Can the Watchtower teach that "Jehovah &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-corrected" id="SPELLING_ERROR_22"&gt;descends&lt;/span&gt; from heaven with an Archangel's voice"? Can they have a teaching as  in verse 17 where the those caught up meet "Jehovah" in the "Air"? (again see reference Bible footnotes)  What is the Bible actually saying?&lt;br /&gt;There are two doctrinal issues which prevent them using the  "J" rendering here.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;1. They teach that Jesus is an Archangel and use this verse as a proof text.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;2. They teach that Jehovah has never been on the earth so it cannot possibly be true that Jehovah comes down from heaven.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;So here is an example of the Bible being very much in second place to the "teachings" of the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_23"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_16"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_18"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_16"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;. Also of note is the sudden disregard for the name Jehovah when it clashes with  doctrinal positions.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;So is the New World Translation "the finest there is"?, helping "honest-hearted" ones find Bible truth?, and is it "unfettered" by religious  "traditions"?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I was shocked when I discovered the many instances where the NWT is in fact doing the opposite of what it claims to do.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I was raised to believe that this was an honest piece of work , instead I found through personal study, many cases where the verses were changed to suit &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_24"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_17"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_19"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_17"&gt;JW&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; beliefs by &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-corrected" id="SPELLING_ERROR_25"&gt;omitting&lt;/span&gt; words , changing words, adding words and in some cases entire phrases.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I lost my confidence in this "translation" many years ago. But I found a new love for the Bible in other more reliable works such as the fine  New International Version (N.I.V.) which I would recommend.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;No translation is perfect of course and many do reflect the beliefs of the translators but in the case of the NWT what has been done is a bridge too far.( Revelation 22:19.)&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/3850995487033495036-7304330778095374386?l=deathorobedience.blogspot.com' alt='' /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/feeds/7304330778095374386/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/05/new-world-translation-examined.html#comment-form' title='2 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/7304330778095374386'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/7304330778095374386'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/05/new-world-translation-examined.html' title='New World Translation examined'/><author><name>Matthew</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08413266173326117804</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='32' height='32' src='http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_bXMuq_iFQxU/SdDRD7-p3xI/AAAAAAAAAB0/U0Meh0Y2nIs/S220/itunes.jpg'/></author><thr:total>2</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3850995487033495036.post-2874013424920754055</id><published>2009-05-16T13:57:00.000-07:00</published><updated>2009-08-02T11:03:42.054-07:00</updated><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='The &quot;Faithful Slave&quot; concept'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='elders'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='jehovah'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='jehovah&apos;s witnesses'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='watchtower'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='apostasy'/><title type='text'>Death or Obedience - The Podcast Part 7</title><content type='html'>&lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"&gt;&lt;a href="http://media.libsyn.com/media/tartanpodcast/doro_7.mp3"&gt;Play&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;a href="http://itunes.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewPodcast?id=310612127"&gt;Get all of the podcasts in iTunes&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"&gt;This is the final part of our second visit from two local elders.&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"&gt;In this podcast you'll notice the huge emphasis Jehovah's Witnesses put on their need to have an organisation to follow, an organisation that will place upon them an enforced unity of belief.&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"&gt;The elders stress their belief that only the 144,000 get the Holy Spirit and that they alone represent Jesus on earth today.&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"&gt;We come back to the issue of the United Nations. One of the elders had previously stated that the United Nations was "just the Beast". In this podcast you'll notice that he denies saying this.&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"&gt;I press one of the elders as to whether he would ever have any affiliation with the UN, notice how he responds.&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"&gt;The elders completely dismiss myself, my wife and my childrens' futures because we are no longer associated with the Watch Tower Society. We're also told that God is not with us, again because we don't believe the teachings of men in Brooklyn. Closeness to God is absolutely linked to the Watch Tower Society in the eyes of these elders, and sadly this is typical of most Jehovah's Witnesses.&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"&gt;The discussion turns from being about the teachings of the organisation to being about our personal character and the sort of people we are and will become. Interestingly, it's tacitly admitted that the lifestyle of the organisation can make you feel bad about yourself.&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/3850995487033495036-2874013424920754055?l=deathorobedience.blogspot.com' alt='' /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/feeds/2874013424920754055/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/05/death-or-obedience-podcast-part-7.html#comment-form' title='15 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/2874013424920754055'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/2874013424920754055'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/05/death-or-obedience-podcast-part-7.html' title='Death or Obedience - The Podcast Part 7'/><author><name>Matthew</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08413266173326117804</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='32' height='32' src='http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_bXMuq_iFQxU/SdDRD7-p3xI/AAAAAAAAAB0/U0Meh0Y2nIs/S220/itunes.jpg'/></author><thr:total>15</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3850995487033495036.post-368138292701819048</id><published>2009-05-08T10:43:00.000-07:00</published><updated>2009-05-11T13:16:50.146-07:00</updated><title type='text'>New light on the Watchtower Society being "appointed"</title><content type='html'>This post is based on the June 15&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_0"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_0"&gt;th&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; 2009 study edition of the Watchtower, page 20.&lt;br /&gt;"The Faithful Steward and it's Governing Body"&lt;br /&gt;&lt;p&gt;This study will set the tone for future-proofing the Watchtower Society Doctrine that their Governing Body is is the voice of  "the faithful slave" mentioned in parable by Jesus in Matthew chapter 24.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;I thought as I  read the study  article  starting on page  20  that the most important thing about this piece is what is missing, what is not said.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;The first paragraph sets the tone of what they are trying to convey.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;"While giving the composite sign of the last days Jesus said, "who really is the faithful and discreet slave?""&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;I believe what they are doing with  the opening paragraph  is placing the authority and position of "the slave" within the context of the signs of the times thus attempting to validate it in a modern setting  without mentioning specifically WHEN  they, (the  &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_1"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_1"&gt;wts's&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; Governing Body) were appointed as the voice or "channel" of this class.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;They then say that Jesus would "reward"  and appoint this slave over all his belongings. Again crucially no time  frame is given for this event. In paragraph 6 it's stated that Jesus had already "appointed" the slave class back in 33 C.E.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;So who is left to be "appointed" in 1919? It would seem they are trying to convey the thought that this has been an ongoing role and the Governing Body are merely the spokesmen and the  latest incarnation of something that has always existed in the same way as they have consistently said that the slave class has always been around. This would help to explain why there is no mention of the year 1919 in the article. It makes it a much more seamless doctrine , with no ugly date-setting from the last century. It also removes the argument that Jesus would never have appointed them in 1919, "look at all the wrong things they taught and were involved in".&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;The change allows a floating doctrine that is not constrained by the parameters of time and past false teachings.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;As the article progresses the usual warnings and spiritual "food" is of course served.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt; &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt; Look at  paragraphs 6. under the heading " The slave appears".&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;" It came into existence in 33c.e."  They use a legitimate Bible event and claim that was Jesus "starting off" the "slave Class" in Pentecost.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;The stuff that's then discussed about who did the teaching is beside the point, the real question is do they have the modern right to be THE TEACHERS?&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;So how  do they move through the gears and apply this on-going "class" to themselves in modern times?&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Usually we would find a dogmatic statement like " Jesus appointed this faithful slave in 1919 after he arrived in kingdom power in 1914"&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;It is nowhere to be seen!!!&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;I firmly believe that since it is a provable fact that 1914 is being mentioned less and less in the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_0"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_2"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_2"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; publications then it would follow that the year 1919 also will be devalued and mentioned less too, as the two dates are inextricably linked.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;This article would be the perfect place to reinforce the  1919 dogma to the rank and file &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_1"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_3"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_3"&gt;JW's&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; in a private study article.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Of course there are no scriptures that support the assertion that Jesus arrived in 1919 and appointed the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_2"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_4"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_4"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; Governing Body or President to such a position, but since when did the Bible get in the way of a good &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_3"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_5"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_5"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; doctrine?&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;The title of the article is "The Faithful Steward and it's Governing Body". This is quite a statement considering Jesus did mention a faithful steward but did NOT  mention a "Governing Body". In fact many Witnesses may be surprised to know that this phrase does not even appear anywhere in the Christian Greek scriptures. So mixing these two phrases together shows a level of manipulation regarding what  Jesus actually said and that The WTS also  have an agenda to fulfill.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;The Governing Body is well aware of the weakness of their chronology which begins with the year 607 B.C.E.  and ends with 1914 C.E. The 2520 year formula is not even a Jehovah's Witness doctrine, it was introduced to C.T. Russell by his friend and associate Nelson Barbour ,a fact documented in the "Proclaimers" book. Nelson Barbour never became a "witness". Russel was so impressed he started teaching it and Jehovah's Witnesses have taught it as Biblical fact ever since. Incredible , but true.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;The book "gentile times reconsidered" delivers a fatal blow to the significance the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_4"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_6"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_6"&gt;wts&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; attach to 607 B.C.E., thus destroying the notion that 1914 was the year the kingdom was born. They know this. They have the manuscripts, sent in by the author Carl &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_7"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_7"&gt;Olof&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;  &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_8"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_8"&gt;Johnsson&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; in the early 1980's.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;This man was an Elder in the Organisation and spent decades researching their claim that 607 B.C.E. was the year Jerusalem was destroyed by Nebuchadnezzar II. He sent in his research to the Governing Body in Brooklyn , which showed all the evidence pointed to 587 B.C.E. ,and was eventually &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_9"&gt;disfellowshipped&lt;/span&gt; for  holding a different view on the matter.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;I firmly believe they are moving away from these dates and the claims associated with them. Instead they are using something altogether more tangible.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Please look to paragraph 11 where they make the link between the opening statement in par. 1 and the claim that the "slave" "appeared" in 33 C.E.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;This paragraph states that "Jesus words clearly indicate that there would still be a faithful and discreet slave class  living on  earth at the time of the end"&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;What words of Jesus? Matthew 24:45 " Who really is the faithful and discreet slave whom his master appointed over his domestics to give them their food at the proper time?"&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Where in this verse which they quote from is Jesus referring to a "class"? &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Where does Jesus say "clearly" they would be "living on earth at the time of the end"?&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;These are suppositions that the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_6"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_9"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_10"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; have to insert to validate the claims which are made in this  paragraph.(11)&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;"As a group this remnant has been appointed over all of Christs belongings here on earth."&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;What would these "belongings" be?&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;This is the most important point which is in my opinion hidden in the rest of the flannel this article contains.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;The "belongings" are the "kingdom's earthly subjects". Yes the 7 million Jehovah's Witnesses are proof that this slave has been appointed!!!&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;The belongings are also "the material facilities used in preaching the good news" Yes, all the Kingdom Halls,  Assembly Halls, Branches, Printing operations and the worldwide Headquarters in Brooklyn N.Y. are PROOF THAT THEY WERE APPOINTED!!!&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;What more  proof does an honest-hearted   person need than that?&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;We exist so therefore we are what we say we are. Classic circular &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_7"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_10"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_11"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; reasoning. Who can argue that there are NOT  7 million &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_8"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_11"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_12"&gt;JW's&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; around the world and that all the of the "material facilities" exist?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;This is a far easier position to substantiate and maintain than the 1919  "appointment" dogma considering 1919 has no scriptural , historical , archaeological ,not to mention rational thought behind it. It is becoming almost laughable to mention the date of 1919 in relation to their claim of God-given authority considering we are a decade into &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_9"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_12"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_13"&gt;th&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;e 21st century, and slowly creeping up on the year 2014.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;I now think that this is the new "Proof" of their authority. The rank and file Witnesses themselves  aren't going to be hard to convince as  most of them cite these reasons as to why they believe it's "the truth", so why not base your authority on it as well? It  makes sense.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;I asked my brother about the scriptural validity of the  1919 appointment and he said "well yes,  it was around about then, but we don't want to be dogmatic about it".&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;It is a bit late to say that , or is it?&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href="http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/Who%20really%20is%20the%20faithful%20and%20discreet%20slave%20whom%20his%20master%20appointed%20over%20his%20domestics,%20to%20give%20them%20their%20food%20at%20the%20proper%20time?%2046%C2%A0Happy%20is%20that%20slave%20if%20his%20master%20on%20arriving%20finds%20him%20doing%20so."&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/3850995487033495036-368138292701819048?l=deathorobedience.blogspot.com' alt='' /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/feeds/368138292701819048/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/05/new-light-on-wts-being-appointed.html#comment-form' title='12 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/368138292701819048'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/368138292701819048'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/05/new-light-on-wts-being-appointed.html' title='New light on the Watchtower Society being &quot;appointed&quot;'/><author><name>Matthew</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08413266173326117804</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='32' height='32' src='http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_bXMuq_iFQxU/SdDRD7-p3xI/AAAAAAAAAB0/U0Meh0Y2nIs/S220/itunes.jpg'/></author><thr:total>12</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3850995487033495036.post-6816734250502312900</id><published>2009-05-01T16:06:00.000-07:00</published><updated>2009-05-01T16:33:01.917-07:00</updated><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='elders'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='death or obedience'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='jehovah&apos;s witnesses'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='podcast'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='watchtower'/><title type='text'>Death or Obedience - The Podcast Part 6</title><content type='html'>&lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"&gt;&lt;a href="http://media.libsyn.com/media/tartanpodcast/doro_6.mp3"&gt;Play the audio&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"&gt;&lt;a href="http://itunes.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewPodcast?id=310612127"&gt;Get the podcasts on iTunes&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"&gt;In this podcast we continue with our second visit from two of the local elders.&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"&gt;The discussion moves onto the Biblical definition of a false prophet. I also provide both elders with evidence relating to the Watch Tower Society's  dishonesty regarding their links to Johannes Greber. Please notice how swiftly this information is dismissed and attention is turned on my character instead.&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"&gt;Listen out for one of the elders saying that Jehovah would allow people to die within the Organisation due to their teachings.&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"&gt;Stunningly, this same elder says that anomalies in the Society's publication is the same as there being anomalies in the Bible. For some reason he also recommends that we read the "God Delusion" by Richard Dawkins . this elder says , "You'll find enough there to disturb you".&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"&gt;Also, the overt use of emotional blackmail may surprise you. Emotions become raw. Listen out for the moment when one of the elders agrees that we're being treated like we're dirt on the bottom of someone's shoe.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"&gt;Thanks for listening to these podcasts. We feel it's important that people hear the standards that the Watch Tower Society sets for itself and the standards that are set for "rank and file" Jehovah's Witnesses.&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"&gt;Please feel free to burn these podcasts onto CD and share them, if you'd like to add them to your website, please do so.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/3850995487033495036-6816734250502312900?l=deathorobedience.blogspot.com' alt='' /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/feeds/6816734250502312900/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/05/death-or-obedience-podcast-part-6.html#comment-form' title='7 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/6816734250502312900'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/6816734250502312900'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/05/death-or-obedience-podcast-part-6.html' title='Death or Obedience - The Podcast Part 6'/><author><name>Matthew</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08413266173326117804</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='32' height='32' src='http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_bXMuq_iFQxU/SdDRD7-p3xI/AAAAAAAAAB0/U0Meh0Y2nIs/S220/itunes.jpg'/></author><thr:total>7</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3850995487033495036.post-2785926374889769552</id><published>2009-04-24T16:27:00.000-07:00</published><updated>2009-05-01T16:09:09.722-07:00</updated><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='bible'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='society'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='jehovah'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='jehovah&apos;s witnesses'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='1914'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='watchtower'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='apostasy'/><title type='text'>Death or Obedience - The Podcast Part 5</title><content type='html'>&lt;style&gt;&lt;/style&gt;Click on the link below to listen to the audio.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;a href="http://media.libsyn.com/media/tartanpodcast/doro_5.mp3"&gt;&lt;span style="text-decoration: underline;"&gt;play the  audio&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;div&gt;&lt;p   style="margin: 0px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;"&gt;&lt;span class="Apple-style-span"   style="font-size:180%;color:#FF0000;"&gt;&lt;span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 18px;"&gt;&lt;b&gt;&lt;span class="Apple-style-span"   style="font-size:130%;color:#000000;"&gt;&lt;span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 16px; font-weight: normal;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/b&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"&gt;My wife and I had already had a visit from two elders, one of whom promised that he'd return.&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p   style="margin: 0px;  font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal;  line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"&gt;True to his word, he returned bringing another local elder with him, who happens to be my brother. This podcast is the first of 3 parts of their visit.&lt;/p&gt;  &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;/p&gt;         &lt;p   style="margin: 0px;  font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal;  line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;"&gt;&lt;span style="font-size:130%;"&gt;&lt;span style="font-weight: bold;"&gt;&lt;span style="color: rgb(51, 51, 255);"&gt;We discuss some of Jehovah's Witnesses unique beliefs&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p   style="margin: 0px;  font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal;  line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;"&gt;&lt;span style="font-size:130%;"&gt;&lt;span style="font-weight: bold;"&gt;&lt;span style="color: rgb(51, 51, 255);"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p   style="margin: 0px;  font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal;  line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;"&gt;&lt;span style="font-size:130%;"&gt;&lt;span style="font-weight: bold;"&gt;&lt;span style="color: rgb(51, 51, 255);"&gt;Is the 1914 doctrine found in scripture?&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p   style="margin: 0px;  font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal;  line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-size:130%;"&gt;&lt;span style="font-weight: bold;"&gt;&lt;span style="color: rgb(51, 51, 255);"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p   style="margin: 0px;  font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal;  line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;"&gt;&lt;span style="font-size:130%;"&gt;&lt;span style="font-weight: bold;"&gt;&lt;span style="color: rgb(51, 51, 255);"&gt;Does the existence of ministerial servants and elders mark one group out as being the "true religion"?&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p face="Helvetica" size="12px" style="margin: 0px;  font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal;  line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-size:130%;"&gt;&lt;span style="font-weight: bold;"&gt;&lt;span style="color: rgb(51, 51, 255);"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;span style="font-size:130%;"&gt;&lt;span style="font-weight: bold;"&gt;&lt;span style="color: rgb(51, 51, 255);"&gt;Have the Watchtower Society added to the gospel ? (Gal 1:8)&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;span style="font-size:130%;"&gt;&lt;span style="font-weight: bold;"&gt;&lt;span style="color: rgb(51, 51, 255);"&gt;Is the "Gentile times" calculation an express Bible teaching?&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;span style="color: rgb(51, 102, 255);"&gt;&lt;/span&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"&gt;All the podcasts can be found on &lt;b&gt;&lt;a href="http://itunes.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewPodcast?id=310612127"&gt;iTunes&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/b&gt;&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; min-height: 14px;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt; &lt;p style="margin: 0px; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 12px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"&gt;I'd love to hear your thoughts on these podcasts, please leave your comments on the website. Or email me.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/3850995487033495036-2785926374889769552?l=deathorobedience.blogspot.com' alt='' /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/feeds/2785926374889769552/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/04/play-death-or-obedience-part-5-my-wife.html#comment-form' title='0 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/2785926374889769552'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/2785926374889769552'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/04/play-death-or-obedience-part-5-my-wife.html' title='Death or Obedience - The Podcast Part 5'/><author><name>Matthew</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08413266173326117804</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='32' height='32' src='http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_bXMuq_iFQxU/SdDRD7-p3xI/AAAAAAAAAB0/U0Meh0Y2nIs/S220/itunes.jpg'/></author><thr:total>0</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3850995487033495036.post-3887081351164019598</id><published>2009-03-30T10:44:00.000-07:00</published><updated>2009-03-30T10:50:21.214-07:00</updated><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='jehovah'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='jehovah&apos;s witnesses'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='audio'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='podcast'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='watchtower'/><title type='text'>Death or Obedience - The Podcast Part 4</title><content type='html'>This is part 4 of the &lt;a href="http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com"&gt;Death or Obedience&lt;/a&gt; Podcast. For the story behind this podcast, be sure to visit the website - &lt;a href="http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com"&gt;deathorobedience.blogspot.com&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;a href="http://media.libsyn.com/media/tartanpodcast/doro_4.mp3"&gt;PLAY THE AUDIO&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;a href="http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/03/death-or-obedience-podcast.html"&gt;Part 1&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;a href="http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/03/death-or-obedience-podcast-part-2.html"&gt;Part 2&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;a href="http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/03/death-or-obedience-podcast-part-3.html"&gt;Part 3&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;This is the final part of our first visit from 2 of the local elders.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Despite previously stating that a person would not be considered an apostate for reading material critical of the Watch Tower Society's teachings, one of the elders now makes the grave comment that passing on such material does designate a person as an apostate.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I am commended for keeping my own counsel - the elder admits that I have not been guilty of discussing my concerns about the Organisation with anyone else. This is an important point to keep in mind as he later claims the opposite to be true.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The elder also contradicts himself as to whether Jehovah has been blessing individuals or groups since 33CE.&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/3850995487033495036-3887081351164019598?l=deathorobedience.blogspot.com' alt='' /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/feeds/3887081351164019598/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/03/death-or-obedience-podcast-part-4.html#comment-form' title='3 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/3887081351164019598'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/3887081351164019598'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/03/death-or-obedience-podcast-part-4.html' title='Death or Obedience - The Podcast Part 4'/><author><name>Matthew</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08413266173326117804</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='32' height='32' src='http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_bXMuq_iFQxU/SdDRD7-p3xI/AAAAAAAAAB0/U0Meh0Y2nIs/S220/itunes.jpg'/></author><thr:total>3</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3850995487033495036.post-8532916876619481526</id><published>2009-03-30T09:49:00.000-07:00</published><updated>2009-03-30T09:59:28.490-07:00</updated><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='death or obedience'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='jehovah&apos;s witnesses'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='audio'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='podcast'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='watchtower'/><title type='text'>Death or Obedience - The Podcast Part 3</title><content type='html'>&lt;a href="http://media.libsyn.com/media/tartanpodcast/doro_3.mp3"&gt;PLAY THE AUDIO&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;a href="http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/03/death-or-obedience-podcast.html"&gt;Part 1&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;a href="http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/03/death-or-obedience-podcast-part-2.html"&gt;Part 2&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;This is part 3 of the &lt;a href="http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com"&gt;Death or Obedience &lt;/a&gt;Podcast. For the story behind this podcast, be sure to visit the website - deathorobedience.blogspot.com&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;In this edition we continue with our visit from 2 of the local elders. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Our discussion moves onto whether the Organisation is inspired by God or not. One of elders admits that it isn't, however, he fails to explain how God can be using it as his agent on earth.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;My wife is put under pressure to talk about any books she may have read which criticise the teachings of the Watch Tower Society. It's pointed out by the elder, though, that reading such literature does not make one an apostate.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;We also broach the life or death topic of organ transplants.&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/3850995487033495036-8532916876619481526?l=deathorobedience.blogspot.com' alt='' /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/feeds/8532916876619481526/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/03/death-or-obedience-podcast-part-3.html#comment-form' title='0 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/8532916876619481526'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/8532916876619481526'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/03/death-or-obedience-podcast-part-3.html' title='Death or Obedience - The Podcast Part 3'/><author><name>Matthew</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08413266173326117804</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='32' height='32' src='http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_bXMuq_iFQxU/SdDRD7-p3xI/AAAAAAAAAB0/U0Meh0Y2nIs/S220/itunes.jpg'/></author><thr:total>0</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3850995487033495036.post-4680756141916710135</id><published>2009-03-30T07:41:00.001-07:00</published><updated>2009-03-30T09:59:28.491-07:00</updated><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='audio'/><title type='text'>Death or Obedience - The Podcast Part 2</title><content type='html'>This is part 2 of the &lt;a href="http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com"&gt;Death or Obedience&lt;/a&gt; Podcast. For the story behind this podcast, be sure to visit the website - &lt;a href="http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com"&gt;deathorobedience.blogspot.com&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;a href="http://media.libsyn.com/media/tartanpodcast/doro_2.mp3"&gt;PLAY THE AUDIO&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;a href="http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/03/death-or-obedience-podcast.html"&gt;Part 1&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;In this edition we continue with our visit from 2 of the local elders. We discuss at length the Watch Tower Society's self-assigned role as God's prophet. Notice, however, how one of the elders states that the Society has never claimed to be a prophet, but were merely running ahead of Jehovah.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Notice also the terms "negative Bible study" and the complete dismissal of the Watch Tower Society's relationship with the United Nations.&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/3850995487033495036-4680756141916710135?l=deathorobedience.blogspot.com' alt='' /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/feeds/4680756141916710135/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/03/death-or-obedience-podcast-part-2.html#comment-form' title='1 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/4680756141916710135'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/4680756141916710135'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/03/death-or-obedience-podcast-part-2.html' title='Death or Obedience - The Podcast Part 2'/><author><name>Matthew</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08413266173326117804</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='32' height='32' src='http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_bXMuq_iFQxU/SdDRD7-p3xI/AAAAAAAAAB0/U0Meh0Y2nIs/S220/itunes.jpg'/></author><thr:total>1</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3850995487033495036.post-3657712486282281286</id><published>2009-03-30T07:00:00.000-07:00</published><updated>2009-03-30T07:04:29.852-07:00</updated><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='society'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='jehovah'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='jehovah&apos;s witnesses'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='audio'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='podcast'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='watchtower'/><title type='text'>Death or Obedience - The Podcast</title><content type='html'>Part 1 - The Elders Come to Visit Part 1 of 4&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-weight:bold;"&gt;&lt;a href="http://media.libsyn.com/media/tartanpodcast/doro_1.mp3"&gt;PLAY THE AUDIO&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Jehovah's Witnesses are required to accept the entire range of teachings and unique beliefs as laid out in Watch Tower Society publications.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Failure to do so results in being cut off, excommunicated, leaving the Jehovah's Witness to face one of two choices;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;a href="http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com"&gt;Death or Obedience.&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;In this series of podcasts we reveal what actually happens when Jehovah's Witnesses start to have doubts as to the scriptural validity of these unique teachings.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;My wife and I were approached by the local elders who wished to visit us to impart some 'scriptural encouragement'. Little did we realise that this visit would eventually lead to us being faced with the choice;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;a href="http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com"&gt;Death or Obedience.&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;In the coming weeks you will hear recorded conversation with Jehovah's Witness elders, culminating with the secretive 'Judicial Committee' hearings that Jehovah's Witnesses are threatened with if they continue to question Watch Tower teachings.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Some of what you will hear may disturb you. Some of what you hear may upset you. The purpose of this podcast is to educate people as to the level of control an average Jehovah's Witness will face from the body of elders.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;In part 1 of this series, my wife and I are visited by 2 local elders to enquire as to our spiritual well-being. This is part 1 of this particular visit which will span 4 podcasts.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Listen out for their unwillingness to admit that any outwith the Watch Tower Society can be considered a Christian, that the Watch Tower Society is, by definition, a false prophet and in particular listen out for one of the elders admitting that their belief of 1914 is not based in scripture.&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/3850995487033495036-3657712486282281286?l=deathorobedience.blogspot.com' alt='' /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/feeds/3657712486282281286/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/03/death-or-obedience-podcast.html#comment-form' title='21 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/3657712486282281286'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/3657712486282281286'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/03/death-or-obedience-podcast.html' title='Death or Obedience - The Podcast'/><author><name>Matthew</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08413266173326117804</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='32' height='32' src='http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_bXMuq_iFQxU/SdDRD7-p3xI/AAAAAAAAAB0/U0Meh0Y2nIs/S220/itunes.jpg'/></author><thr:total>21</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3850995487033495036.post-8322005605007806484</id><published>2009-03-15T07:59:00.000-07:00</published><updated>2009-03-15T14:38:06.505-07:00</updated><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='Ransom'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='Memorial'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='heavenly hope'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='New covenant'/><title type='text'>The Memorial, Ransom and New Covenant</title><content type='html'>The  Memorial is an annual event when  Jehovah's Witnesses  give official thanks to Jesus for His Ransom Sacrifice, and thus their way to eternal life. We will look at the subject of the Ransom first.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The Ransom and the New Covenant are treated in a very legalistic way by the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_0"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_0"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_0"&gt;wtbts&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;.&lt;br /&gt;This is an example from the reasoning  book   under the heading of "The Ransom" in which&lt;br /&gt;there is an argument used to back up the position of the majority of attendees who refuse to partake of the emblems on the night.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;"Reasoning" p. 309 par. 2&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;John 10:16: “I have other sheep, which are not of this fold; those also I must bring, and they will listen to my voice, and they will become one flock, one shepherd.” (These “other sheep” come under the loving care of Jesus Christ while the remnant of the “little flock” of Kingdom heirs is still on earth; thus the “other sheep” can be associated with the Kingdom heirs as part of the “one flock.” They all enjoy many of the same benefits from Jesus’ sacrifice, but not identically so, because they have different destinies.)&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;So the "little flock" are the only partakers, everyone is told at the Memorial. The rest are the "other sheep" who do not partake but strangely STILL  get the benefit of Jesus sacrifice.&lt;br /&gt;I have yet to see in  God's word where this arrangement is explained, or have any Witness explain how association with "the remnant" gives a person salvation by proxy.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;It seems incredible to me that the" Faithful Slave" devote SEVEN whole pages to their discussion of the ransom in this book WITHOUT mentioning the Last supper or  ANY of the relevant scriptures that speak of partaking of the flesh and blood of Jesus, and absolutely NO MENTION of 1 Tim 2;5 which says that Jesus is our mediator (i. e. all mankind who accept the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-corrected" id="SPELLING_ERROR_1"&gt;sacrifice&lt;/span&gt;). Also  NO MENTION  of the NEW COVENANT. They have reduced the whole subject to a discussion of the origins of sin, and why we need the Ransom , and crucially leave THE ONE PAGE OF THE &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-corrected" id="SPELLING_ERROR_2"&gt;INSTRUCTIONS&lt;/span&gt; that you need to finish the project.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Right at the end however is the rub.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;page 310&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;What is required of us in order to benefit lastingly from Jesus perfect &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-corrected" id="SPELLING_ERROR_3"&gt;sacrifice&lt;/span&gt;?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;John 3;36 "he that &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-corrected" id="SPELLING_ERROR_4"&gt;exercises&lt;/span&gt; faith in the son has everlasting life"&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;so far so good......&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-corrected" id="SPELLING_ERROR_5"&gt;Biblical&lt;/span&gt; ,accurate and simple.....&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Next question from page 311 "Reasoning"&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;What effect should this provision have on how we use our lives?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Titus 2; 13,14 " Christ Jesus ......gave himself for us that he might deliver us from every sort of lawlessness and cleanse for himself a people  peculiarly his own , zealous for fine works" (Appreciation for this marvelous provision should move us to have a zealous share in those works that Christ assigned to his true followers)&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;VERY, VERY clever. A scripture that speaks of the Ransom  AND works in the same context!  Almost like one needs to show the works to benefit, rather than good works being a result of dedicating one's life to Jesus.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;So that verse is really telling us that if we really &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-corrected" id="SPELLING_ERROR_6"&gt;appreciate&lt;/span&gt;  what Jesus did then we will do the works that he assigned us to? Sounds suspiciously like the parable of the faithful slave that he also "assigned"or appointed to "work" for his interests.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The verse says that the people for himself  (not Jehovah) would already be  zealous for fine works. But what they want people to take from the verse is that it's those works which are really the key.... Yes the Watchtower works program: Meetings, field ministry, assemblies, &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_1"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_1"&gt;pre&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;. study.And "Jesus true followers"?....Jehovah's Witnesses today.They  are the ones who have the knowledge and the appreciation and the works to go with it.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Surely the most appreciative act a person could do would be to accept the Ransom or New Covenant provision which the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_7"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_2"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_2"&gt;wts&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; seem to think are two separate things.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The Bible makes it very plain what is required of ANY individual wishing to please God.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Pray to God through Jesus.(John 14:6-9)&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Put faith in and believe in Jesus as one's only saviour (Titus 2:13)&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Ask for your sins to be forgiven,(Matthew 6:9,10)&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Show you want to be one of Jesus' brothers by sharing the Lord's meal when you get the chance.&lt;br /&gt;(1 Corinthians 11:26)&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The "Reasoning" book also has a section on "The Memorial" where we can get an idea of the Watchtower teachings on that subject.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Pages 266-69&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The first point to be made is there's no basis in scripture to say that it should only be celebrated once year, as though to do so more often would be somehow showing a lack of respect or a devaluing of Jesus provision.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Paul wrote in 1 Corinthians 11:26 . . ".For as often as you eat this loaf and drink this cup, you keep proclaiming the death of the Lord, until he arrives."&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Jehovah's Witnesses believe Jesus arrived in 1914 so why do they still observe the Lord's evening meal?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Let us assume that we should properly observe it regardless of whether or not Jesus arrived in 1914. What should one do on such an occasion?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Most of the material deals with the subject in a fair and objective manner, explaining it's significance and who Jesus asked to partake.&lt;br /&gt;Then this question is posed on page 267:-&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Who is to partake of the bread and the wine?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Who partook when Jesus instituted the Lord’s Evening Meal shortly before he died? Eleven faithful followers to whom Jesus said: “I make a covenant with you, just as my Father has made a covenant with me, for a kingdom.” (Luke 22:29) They were all persons who were being invited to share with Christ in his heavenly Kingdom. (John 14:2, 3) All who partake of the bread and wine today should also be persons whom Christ brings into that ‘covenant for a kingdom.’&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Again this is &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-corrected" id="SPELLING_ERROR_8"&gt;Biblical&lt;/span&gt;  and sound so far.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Then this next section says on page 268:-&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;How many are there that partake? Jesus said that only a “little flock” would receive the heavenly Kingdom as their reward. (Luke 12:32) The full number would be 144,000. (Rev. 14:1-3) That group began to be selected in 33 C.E. Reasonably, there would be only a small number partaking now.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Jesus did indeed utter those words, but where in any of the gospels did Jesus make the statement that is presented after his words?  Namely that the number of those who would inherit the Kingdom would  be limited to 144,000 of persons who go to heaven?&lt;br /&gt;It's nowhere to be found.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;What about the apostle Paul who was quoted above, did he perhaps in the 14 books of the Bible he wrote make mention of the number being limited to 144,000 persons having the heavenly hope?&lt;br /&gt;No he did not.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;A question to ask one's self is; if you have the hope of living in a paradise earth, when did this secondary hope become available?&lt;br /&gt;In the early days of the organisation which is now known as Jehovah's Witnesses EVERY  person had the heavenly hope as the Bible describes. "Only from the year 1935 did the  "other sheep" class have an earthly hope" would be what most Witnesses would say.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;However this is actually NOT now what is the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-corrected" id="SPELLING_ERROR_9"&gt;official&lt;/span&gt; doctrine.In 2007, the 1935 teaching was changed with a simple admission:&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;"Thus it appears that we can not set a specific date for when the calling of Christians to the heavenly hope ends." Watchtower 2007 May 1 p.31&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;So very simply put, if the heavenly hope didn't actually close in the year 1935 then where does that leave those who  claim an earthly hope?&lt;br /&gt;"Judge " Rutherford didn't even bother TRYING  to give credibility to the year by means of scripture, for there are no scriptures to support the year in question. Instead he used the mention of a  "great crowd" in Revelation to insist that these were the ones who would have the earthly hope. This in itself  was a reversal in doctrine from the notion that the "great crowd" was a secondary heavenly class of less faithful ones.&lt;br /&gt;Every time the book of Revelation mentions the "great crowd" it's in a heavenly setting, not on earth!&lt;br /&gt;Revelation 19;1 even says "After these things I heard what was as a loud voice of a great crowd IN HEAVEN." which the Revelation Climax book does not even try to explain.( page 272 Rev climax)&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;It's a stark thought, ask yourself when did your earthly hope become &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-corrected" id="SPELLING_ERROR_10"&gt;available&lt;/span&gt;?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Can it be backed up by scripture?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Why do you feel that you will be living forever in a paradise earth when the New Testament consistently speaks of "the Kingdom of the Heavens"?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;What does Jesus say about your hope for eternal life?&lt;br /&gt;He made the statement below a full year before  the Lord's evening meal was first held knowing it would be the only hope for mankind.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;(John 6:53) . . .Accordingly Jesus said to them: “Most truly I say to you, Unless you eat the flesh of the Son of man and drink his blood, you have no life in yourselves.&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/3850995487033495036-8322005605007806484?l=deathorobedience.blogspot.com' alt='' /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/feeds/8322005605007806484/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/03/memorial-ransom-and-new-covenant.html#comment-form' title='0 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/8322005605007806484'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/8322005605007806484'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/03/memorial-ransom-and-new-covenant.html' title='The Memorial, Ransom and New Covenant'/><author><name>Matthew</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08413266173326117804</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='32' height='32' src='http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_bXMuq_iFQxU/SdDRD7-p3xI/AAAAAAAAAB0/U0Meh0Y2nIs/S220/itunes.jpg'/></author><thr:total>0</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3850995487033495036.post-2520157004382877111</id><published>2009-03-09T13:36:00.000-07:00</published><updated>2009-05-11T14:14:19.253-07:00</updated><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='wts'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='C.T.Russell'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='governing body'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='organisation'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='bible'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='watchtower'/><title type='text'>The Watchtower view of the Bible</title><content type='html'>How do the modern concepts and teachings of the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_0"&gt;wts&lt;/span&gt; differ from the old ones of 100 years ago?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Here are some examples from the past of their views on  understanding scripture relative to the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_1"&gt;wts&lt;/span&gt; organisation.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;"Bible classes and and Bible studies are all to no purpose until the Lord, in due time , sent them the  'Bible keys' through the society"  wt10/01/1909 p4482&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;"If the six volumes of SCRIPTURE STUDIES are practically the bible topically arranged, with Bible proof texts given we might not improperly name the volumes- the Bible in an arranged form. That is to say ,they are not merely comments on the Bible , but they are practically the Bible itself...." wt9/15/1910p4685.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;"A person would go into darkness after two years of reading the Bible alone; would be in the light reading the studies in the scriptures alone" wt9/15/1910.p4685&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Now some more recent statements.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;"Heavy research is not &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-corrected" id="SPELLING_ERROR_2"&gt;necessary&lt;/span&gt;.The Watchtower has done it for you.The most beneficial study you can do is to read the Watchtower or Awake! or  a new book by the organisation." wt6/01/67 p338&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;"The Bible is a sealed book except to the organisation"Wt7/01/73p402&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;"Jehovah caused the Bible to be written in such a way that you need his human channel to understand it"WT 2/15/1981p.17&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;"Unless we are in touch  with this channel of communication that god is using, we will not progress along the road to life, no matter how much Bible study we do."WT 12/01/81p 27.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;"An individual must have The Watchtower to understand the Bible" 1983 yearbook p.21&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;"Our coming to know "the truth"- the entire body of Christian teachings that HAS BECOME PART OF THE BIBLE - and adhering to it are essential for our salvation." 15/12/2009 p.28,study edition.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;And this is link is on the official web page of JW's right now.&lt;br /&gt;(click on the link below)&lt;br /&gt; &lt;p class="title"&gt;&lt;a href="http://www.watchtower.org/e/20050901/article_01.htm"&gt;Mennonites Search for Bible Truth&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;  &lt;p class="blurb"&gt;Johann told his wife and children: “You must always read &lt;cite&gt;The Watchtower&lt;/cite&gt;. It will help you to understand the Bible.”&lt;/p&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;These statements are not merely  the views of the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_3"&gt;wts&lt;/span&gt; , but are rather enforced doctrine that if any &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_4"&gt;JW&lt;/span&gt; was to disagree with would mean his removal from the congregation.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The import of these quotes is that the Bible is basically a book for the organisation's Governing Body to interpret. No individual can operate outside of these parameters.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;A fair question to ask would be; how did God-fearing Christians manage to please God and attain salvation before the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society appeared in the late 19&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_5"&gt;th&lt;/span&gt; century?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Is it really likely that no one was able to understand the Bible properly until C.T. Russell explained it to them through his books? As all of his books are now &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-corrected" id="SPELLING_ERROR_6"&gt;spiritually&lt;/span&gt; defunct,how could his views be the only way to salvation?If you believed his teachings nowadays you would be &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_7"&gt;disfellowshipped&lt;/span&gt;.&lt;br /&gt;What about the two billion professed Christians around the world today? Can all of these people who have 'just' the Bible be living in a spiritual vacuum, without any hope for salvation?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I think the most pertinent scriptures that come to mind are John 14;26 "But the helper, the Holy Spirit, which the Father will send in my name, that one will teach you all things and bring back to your minds all the things I told you."&lt;br /&gt;and John 15;26 "When the helper arrives that I will send you from the Father, the spirit of the truth, which proceeds from the Father, that one will bear witness about me"&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Far from a publishing corporation or even an individual  or group, Jesus promised that the Holy Spirit , a helper and teacher would instruct people and witness about him.&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/3850995487033495036-2520157004382877111?l=deathorobedience.blogspot.com' alt='' /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/feeds/2520157004382877111/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/03/watchtower-view-of-bible.html#comment-form' title='5 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/2520157004382877111'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/2520157004382877111'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/03/watchtower-view-of-bible.html' title='The Watchtower view of the Bible'/><author><name>Matthew</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08413266173326117804</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='32' height='32' src='http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_bXMuq_iFQxU/SdDRD7-p3xI/AAAAAAAAAB0/U0Meh0Y2nIs/S220/itunes.jpg'/></author><thr:total>5</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3850995487033495036.post-6883645048850649228</id><published>2009-03-08T14:04:00.000-07:00</published><updated>2009-08-20T12:18:01.193-07:00</updated><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='tract'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='The &quot;Faithful Slave&quot; concept'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='prophecy'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='bible'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='society'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='prophet'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='tower'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='jehovah'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='jehovah&apos;s witnesses'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='christian'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='watch'/><category scheme='http://www.blogger.com/atom/ns#' term='watchtower'/><title type='text'>The Concept of the "Faithful and Discreet Slave"</title><content type='html'>&lt;span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);"&gt;The Doctrine of the "faithful and discreet slave"&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;This is perhaps the most important doctrine of the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society( &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_0"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_0"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;),  although strangely most &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_1"&gt;Jehovah's  Witnesses&lt;/span&gt; are not aware of the acute significance of the teaching.The belief stems from the question Jesus himself posed in  Matthew 24:45-47   “Who really is the faithful and discreet slave whom his master appointed over his domestics, to give them their food at the proper time? 46 Happy is that slave if his master on arriving finds him doing so. 47 Truly I say to YOU, He will appoint him over all his belongings.&lt;br /&gt;This idea was first promoted in the early days of the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_2"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_1"&gt;wts&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; organisation.  The New World Translation (NWT) of the Bible was not yet in use, so the term used was "Faithful and wise servant"- which applied solely to C.T.Russell(president of the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_3"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_2"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;)  himself. This teaching  continued for many years after his death in the year 1916. After J. F. Rutherford had been president for many years the doctrine was modified to the present format where all of the remnant of the "144,000" are in fact the "faithful  slave" and are in turn represented by the small group of men at H.Q. in Brooklyn N.Y..&lt;br /&gt;The basic import of this doctrine has not changed at all over the 130 years of the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_4"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_3"&gt;WTS's&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; existence. The Idea is that The &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_5"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_4"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; is God's "channel of communication" on the earth and therefore the members of the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_6"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_5"&gt;JW&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; faith are required to have unwavering confidence and faith in what the organisation teaches via the published material.The &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_7"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_6"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; teach that they were "appointed" as the faithful slave circa 1919 C.E.. Jesus apparently made an inspection of all of the Christian groups and decided that the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_8"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_7"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; were the most worthy.&lt;br /&gt;                                                                                                    &lt;br /&gt;                                                                                                             &lt;span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);"&gt;The Verses in Question. &lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;                                                                                                                                                                                                                                   &lt;br /&gt;There are a number of issues that should be of concern regarding this teaching , and perhaps the best place to start is with the Bible itself. Firstly is it reasonable  to conclude that this parable has a real time prophetic application and that the benefactors of Jesus invisible inspection would in fact be placed in a position of absolute authority?&lt;br /&gt;Benjamin Wilson's Emphatic &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_9"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_8"&gt;Diaglott&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; gives the definition of a parable - "it denotes a fictitious narrative , invented for the purpose of conveying truth in a less offensive or more engaging manner than that of direct assertion". So in other words a story....Why are there not a raft of prophecies(and modern day applications) concerning the many, many parables Jesus gave? Could it be that &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_10"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_9"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; only make application of the one's that suit their purposes, i.e. "the Dragnet" parable?&lt;br /&gt;Can one derive from the Bible any mention of Jesus coming to inspect the worlds religions at a specific time and thereafter "appointing" one as  "God's mouthpiece" to the exclusion of all others?&lt;br /&gt;Also worth noting in the verses in question is the fact that it is Jesus himself who does the appointing ,not the slave who appoints himself or makes a claim to that effect.&lt;br /&gt;These are all very valid questions but on close inspection of the context of the verses in question a more startling fact becomes apparent. Remember Jesus has just given his counsel regarding the "signs of the times" and the "end of the system of things". In fact  Vs. 36-44  describe  the very end of the system, where a comparison is drawn with the destruction of Noah's day and verse 42 shows that this is speaking of the very  day of Jesus coming as opposed to a general period of time.&lt;br /&gt;The whole import of Jesus words is of NOT knowing the day of his inspection , hence  "keep on the watch"  because the son of man will come "at an hour that you do not expect him".And the reward that the faithful ones would receive? ,being given all his belongings, i.e. their Kingdom inheritance.&lt;br /&gt;We then come to the verses in question 45-47 where the "slave" doctrine originates. Is it  reasonable to conclude that these verses apply to a time some 90 years ago?&lt;br /&gt;Since the Master's arrival is at a time when the domestics or slaves  do not expect , some within the household are warned against "beating" their fellow slaves because they feel the Master is delaying.This is further evidence that the actual meaning behind the parable is to counsel or warn Christ's brothers against both mistreatment of their fellow "slaves" and also that they must remain spiritually alert. Surely the counsel Jesus gave in all his parables were for all his followers for the whole period until the judgement day, which is why there is  an element within most of his parables of warning and judgement regarding a Christian's life course. If this parable has already been fulfilled then the whole point Jesus was making in this parable is now moot, an historical curiosity.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);"&gt;                                                                                                               Does the evidence support the claim?&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;When one has a scientific theory the only way that it becomes accepted scientific fact is when the available evidence proves it to be correct.Granted the Bible and spiritual matters cannot always  be subjected to analysis in this way as some things are impossible to establish beyond doubt and are in areas which require faith. But in this  case let us treat it as a theory to be established or cast aside. Let us suppose that there was a "slave" and the Jesus did appoint the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_11"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_10"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; as such. Let us examine the notion by the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_12"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_11"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; own criteria.&lt;br /&gt;The nation of Israel were God's chosen people in much the same way as the "spiritual Israel" is today.Moses was the spokesperson and passed on laws , commands and directions to the nation from Jehovah. However when we examine literal Israel's direction we find that Divine wisdom is present, in such matters as sanitation, hygiene in connection with the treatment of dead bodies, etc.The nation themselves would have no idea why they did those things but God's wisdom would have been followed regardless. This is not to mention the ten commandments that Moses passed on to the people. Flawless, eternal, unchanging laws that have stood the test of time many thousands of years later.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);"&gt;Laws and Commands.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="font-family:arial;"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Do the "slave's" teachings hold up under the same scrutiny? Firstly the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_13"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_12"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; has a long history of making decisions on medical matters and enforcing it as law within the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_14"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_13"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; membership.If any &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_15"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_14"&gt;JW&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; dared to speak out and disagree or engage in the banned action they would be excluded from the group by &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_16"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_15"&gt;disfellowshipping&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;.&lt;br /&gt;As an example the teaching that the medical practice of vaccination was a "crime, an outrage, and a delusion"  on the grounds that blood was being misused. This is a striking example of the lack of even basic scientific knowledge. It became clear that the vaccinations in question contained  animal matter, but NOT blood.Surely if Jehovah God were directing the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_17"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_16"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; as they claim there would be a similar input from God to that of Israel? In other words advanced Divine knowledge that superseded any human reasoning on the matter in question. But instead what do we see? , the exact opposite. Wrong , very wrong teachings,that cost people's health and in some cases lives.                                                                                                                                                                                              Is this an isolated case though? No, unfortunately not. From 1967-1980 the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_18"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_17"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; taught and enforced the ruling that  human organ transplants were against God's laws as set forth in the scriptures. The argument used  was that taking such a transplant was analogous to " cannibalism" and that since &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_19"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_18"&gt;JW's&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; do not accept blood( which is an organ) then it would follow that any other organ-transplant would be unacceptable to &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_20"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_19"&gt;JW's&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;. Classic &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_21"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_20"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; circular reasoning at it's best, or worst, tragically as many persons either died or suffered badly because of this  intrusion into peoples lives. This policy was quietly reversed in a 1980 W.T. question from readers which stated that there was no Bible injunction which would prevent those whose conscience&lt;br /&gt;allowed them to now accept an organ transplant. Again the question must be asked, does this appear to be an organisation being led by God's Spirit to pass on commands and laws from heaven? Where is the evidence of God's hand in the matter? Would God really  cause  death or harm to any of his servants by these erroneous and ill conceived teachings being given out via his "channel of communication"?&lt;br /&gt;What I would also ask is How does the process of "truth" being conveyed to the Governing Body actually work? Do they pray and then receive direction from the Holy Spirit as to what to write? That sounds an awful lot like how the Bible was written UNDER INSPIRATION.  Since the Governing Body say that they do not have any more Holy Spirit than anyone else why then do all Jehovah's Witnesses have to listen to them as they would "the voice of God". It just doesn't make any coherent, logical sense.&lt;br /&gt;The above "doctrines" are two of the more serious "truths" that &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_22"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_21"&gt;JW's&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; have had to accept only for them to be scrapped later. There are of course many examples in a similar vein- "miracle wheat" , the "radio &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_23"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_22"&gt;biola&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;" device which could diagnose /cure the sick (both items for sale to the brothers in the publications), the 20 year tirade against the use of aluminium cookware on the grounds that it was thought to cause many death dealing ailments. All these things do not make a very good case for the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_24"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_23"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; being appointed as God's "Faithful slave".&lt;br /&gt;                                         &lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);"&gt;                                                                                                                              Spiritual direction.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The above represents the more extreme and dangerous teachings which could threaten a persons life, but what about the idea that the "slave" is meant to feed his fellow domestics?&lt;br /&gt;It is of course NOT implied in Jesus' words at all that the food is in fact "spiritual food", that is dispensed in the form of literature about the Bible , rather than the bible itself. And that at his "appointed time" a small group of men via  international publishing corporation would then assume God-given authority over all &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_25"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_24"&gt;JW's&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; spiritual direction.&lt;br /&gt;Let us look at a number of examples of the "food" being provided for &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_26"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_25"&gt;JW&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; consumption.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;                                                                                                                          &lt;span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);"&gt;Claims and  Dates&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The last days began in- 1799. strike that-1874, before agreeing   on 1914.( The current teaching  is that the year 1914 is not linked by time to Armageddon's coming.)&lt;br /&gt;The year 1914 will see Armageddon and the resurrection of &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_27"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_26"&gt;JW&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; anointed living on earth to heaven.&lt;br /&gt;1918 will see the end of all the churches on earth.&lt;br /&gt;The year 1925 will see Isaac ,David and Jacob resurrected to the earth.(a house was built for this purpose).&lt;br /&gt;The end of this system will occur in 1975.&lt;br /&gt;"It is unlikely we will see the  the year 2000 before the end of this system". -statement in the publications.&lt;br /&gt;These are just a few of the truly colossal amount of failed prophetic dates that the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_28"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_27"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; have provided to the faithful for consumption. Not one of the above predictions materialised.&lt;br /&gt;                                                                                                                             Interpretation&lt;br /&gt;Even though the Bible says that interpretations belong God, this does not prevent the "slave" from offering such for spiritual consumption.Surely Jehovah would be able to cast light on his word if he was directing the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_29"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_28"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;? Also ask yourself do the following examples show the "light getting brighter" when in some cases the "new light" can be the exact opposite of the former teaching?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Will those who perished at Sodom be resurrected? Between 1879 and 1989 the answer went back and forth between yes and no a staggering EIGHT times even changing from no to yes during one year- 1988!&lt;br /&gt;Who is the alpha and the Omega? Between 1955 and 1988(current teaching) this was either Jehovah  or Jesus , this changed four times.&lt;br /&gt;Who is Michael? In 1917 in the "finished mystery" book he is rather absurdly said to be none other than the POPE! Nowadays of course it's taught that he is Jesus.&lt;br /&gt;Where is heaven? In the book  "reconciliation" It's confidently stated that it is in the "&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_30"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_29"&gt;Pleides&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;" constellation, a statement    which was later withdrawn.&lt;br /&gt;Who built the great pyramid at Giza and for what purpose? The &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_31"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_30"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; taught for approximately 50 years that it was built under Jesus direction and  was a "witness in stone" to the 1914 teaching and supported the Bible record too.  It was later stated that it was in fact Built by Satan and had nothing to do with God's purpose or the bible.&lt;br /&gt;What do the "1600 furlongs" spoken of in revelation refer to? In 1917 it was taught this &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-corrected" id="SPELLING_ERROR_32"&gt;referred&lt;/span&gt; to the distance between the place where the book "the finished mystery" was written and the place where it was published in America, provided u travel by a certain &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_33"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_31"&gt;Lackawanna&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; railroad and then take the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_34"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_32"&gt;Hoboken&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; ferry! Truly Amazing......Nowadays it's explained that it just means destruction in a big way.(Rev Climax bk.)&lt;br /&gt;Who are the seven spirits or angels of Revelation? They are the seven volumes of the series "studies in the scriptures"(1917)&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0);"&gt;                                                                                                                                In conclusion.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt; The above is only a small fraction of the many strange , clouded views, and interpretations that have been espoused over the 140 years or so of the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_35"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_33"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;. Does the doctrine hold up under inspection, and  is it sound &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-corrected" id="SPELLING_ERROR_36"&gt;evidential&lt;/span&gt;y? Is it an explicit bible teaching, and did Jesus intend this parable to have a prophetic application?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;However there are far more serious and damaging doctrines that witnesses HAVE to accept, such as the &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_37"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_34"&gt;WTS&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; views on who is part of the new covenant and who Jesus is mediator of.  These teachings are against the very core of what being a Christian means. All of &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_38"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_35"&gt;JW&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; beliefs hinge on the mental acceptance  that the  &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_39"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_36"&gt;WTS's&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; authority is God given through the "slave" class. There have been many books written that deal with the whole subject in an excellent fashion, one such is "Captives of a concept" by Don Cameron, a very worthwhile read for all &lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_40"&gt;&lt;span class="blsp-spelling-error" id="SPELLING_ERROR_37"&gt;JW's&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt; and those who have left or have any connection with this Organisation.&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/3850995487033495036-6883645048850649228?l=deathorobedience.blogspot.com' alt='' /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/feeds/6883645048850649228/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/03/doctrine-of-faithful-and-discreet-slave.html#comment-form' title='7 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/6883645048850649228'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/3850995487033495036/posts/default/6883645048850649228'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://deathorobedience.blogspot.com/2009/03/doctrine-of-faithful-and-discreet-slave.html' title='The Concept of the &quot;Faithful and Discreet Slave&quot;'/><author><name>Matthew</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08413266173326117804</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:image rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#thumbnail' width='32' height='32' src='http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_bXMuq_iFQxU/SdDRD7-p3xI/AAAAAAAAAB0/U0Meh0Y2nIs/S220/itunes.jpg'/></author><thr:total>7</thr:total></entry></feed>
